"some many"?

Fri Jun 12 07:20:58 UTC 2009

The term "some many" perhaps emerged as a kidism (to coin a word).  If the "so" in "so many" is mispoken (via an accent) by an adult as "suh" then "so many" becomes "suh many" which sounds the same to kids as "some many" in fluid speech.  So they think they're hearing "some many" instead of "so many" and they start writing it that way, which is phonetially true to what they are hearing.  Kids can gloss over the fact that it doesn't make sense.  It's gotta be right if the big people say it that way.

An example is kids hearing the word "hock" for "hawk" by awe-dropping adults, so they hear the term "hawk your wares" mispoken as "hock your wares", which means to pawn them instead of sell them.  Then kids grow up and actually spell the phrase as they've heard it, "hock your wares".  The adults are thinking "hawk", but as awe-droppers they're saying "hock".  The kids hear "hock" and don't realize what's going on.  Dialect inventions, like awe-dropping and vowel swapping, are causing misunderstanding.

Points to a need to stablize pronunciation through our educational establishments. The way our major news broadcasters in USA speak is a good model, although awe-dropping is even sneaking in there.  I heard Charles Gibson say "Honk Kong" with the "ah" instead of "awe" vowel recently.  I wonder how the Chinese say it.  Thefreedictionary.com has it with "awe" vowels, but m-w.com has it with "ah" vowels and with notation that shows "ah" vowels.  But m-w.com has a female awe-dropper saying the word.  She also mispronounces the word "awe" as "ah" though the notation says "awe".

I believe m-w.com is making many awe-dropping errors.  "Boss" is said with the "ah" vowel with notation as such, yet "loss,toss,moss" are said with the "awe" vowel.  Why change boss?  It always was with the "awe" vowel as well.  This is not good.  Accent affectations can be infectations.

Tom Zurinskas, USA - CT20, TN3, NJ33, FL5+
see truespel.com

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> Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2009 20:45:23 -0400
> From: hfwstahlke at GMAIL.COM
> Subject: Re: "some many"?
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender: American Dialect Society
> Poster: Herb Stahlke
> Subject: Re: "some many"?
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> This is the first eggcorn I've seen that violates a syntactic
> cooccurrence restriction. "Some" and "many" don't cooccur, so what
> does it say about English speakers who write this eggcorn? Clearly
> it's a feature of writing rather than of speech, although it seems to
> arise from the phonetic identity of reduced "so" before /m/ and
> reduced "some." What doesn't make sense is how something that isn't
> syntactically possible shows up as the written form for [sm-'mEni].
>
> Herb
>
> On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 10:44 AM, Laurence Horn wrote:
>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
>> Sender: American Dialect Society
>> Poster: Laurence Horn
>> Subject: Re: "some many"?
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> At 9:17 PM +0800 6/11/09, Randy Alexander wrote:
>>>On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 8:10 PM, Tom Zurinskas wrote:
>>>> The "some many" quote was written at this site.
>>>>
>>>> =20
>>>>
>>>>
>>>http://www.lockergnome.com/windows/2009/06/10/bring-the-quick-launch-toolba=
>>>> r-back-in-windows-7/
>>>>
>>>> You bring up an intersting point. ? We don't know from quote marks
>>>>if it's a=
>>>> ? written quote or spoken quote. ? We need a different symbol. ?
>>>>We'll make th=
>>>> at `"yak yak yak"`=2C unless there is a precedent. ? The symbol
>>>>(`) is locat=
>>>> ed on my keyboard at top row left with the tilde (~). ? I don't
>>>>know the nam=
>>>> e.
>>>
>>>If we provide a link, then whether the quote was spoken or written
>>>should be obvious.
>>>
>> Or we can google "some many" and find not just some but many
>> instances, at least some (if not many) of which do seem to be
>> eggcornish reconstructions of "so many". Some may be from non-native
>> speakers--
>>
>> why are some many girl getting pregant so young these days?
>> http://www.gaiaonline.com/forum/lifestyle-discussion/why-are-some-many-girl-getting-pregant-so-young-these-days/t.50698569_16/?
>>
>> Many people feel confused why there are some many different prices on
>> so called "BB/CC" grade of Chinese Poplar plywood?
>> http://www.globalholz.de/China-Plywood-Grade_and_Construction.doc
>>
>> Perhaps we can combine this thread with the earlier one on the
>> consequences of English globalizing to China.
>>
>>
>> LH
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
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