Submariner [was "thousand-yard stare"]

Tue Jul 27 18:47:51 UTC 2010

"Squid" seems to postdate the appearance of the notorious giant squid in
_20,000 Leagues Under the Sea_ (1956).  But cf. _Treasure Island_ (1950):
"You blundering squid!" (That's pirate-to-pirate.)

Earliest in the relevant sense in HDAS: 1966.  I've never encountered in WW2
writings.

JL

On Tue, Jul 27, 2010 at 2:15 PM, Dave Wilton <dave at wilton.net> wrote:

> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Dave Wilton <dave at WILTON.NET>
> Subject:      Re: Submariner [was "thousand-yard stare"]
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Squid" is commonly used in the Army and the Air Force too, although they
> probably have less opportunity to use it than do the Marines.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: American Dialect Society [mailto:ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf
> Of
> Bill Palmer
>  Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 10:45 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Submariner [was "thousand-yard stare"]
>
> Ah, good natured service rivalry.
>
> I never heard "squid" used by anyone other than Marines to refer to the
> Navy
> or naval personnel. The compliment is richly returned as "jarhead", or
> "seagoing bellhop", inter alia, plus countless jokes pointing out the
> general lack of intellectual capacity among Marines.
>
> Yes,  "bubblehead" is common for submarine-ers, as is "sewerpipe sailor".
>
> Bill P
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dave Wilton" <dave at WILTON.NET>
> To: <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 1:04 PM
> Subject: Re: Submariner [was "thousand-yard stare"]
>
>
> > ---------------------- Information from the mail
> > header -----------------------
> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Poster:       Dave Wilton <dave at WILTON.NET>
> > Subject:      Re: Submariner [was "thousand-yard stare"]
> >
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---
> >
> > Submariners like the sobriquet "bubblehead" even less. The Navy is made
> up
> > of airedales, bubbleheads, and skimmers. "Squid" is the generic term.
> >
> > One of the favorite taunts of Army guys was to refer to any Navy ship as
> > an
> > "LGB," or "large gray boat."
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: American Dialect Society [mailto:ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf
> > Of
> > Bill Palmer
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 9:32 AM
> > To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Submariner [was "thousand-yard stare"]
> >
> > I did not serve in submarines in my navy career, but 100% of those I was
> > acquainted with would correct anyone who pronounced it sub-mariner,
> > informing them that it was submarine-er.  I never really thought it made
> > much difference, but they were a little touchy on the subject.
> >
> > I never really liked it when they called our ships of the line "surface
> > skimmers", or when they proclaimed that there were only two types of
> > ships:
> > submarines and targets.
> >
> >
> > Bill P
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "David A. Daniel" <dad at POKERWIZ.COM>
> > To: <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 12:00 PM
> > Subject: Submariner [was "thousand-yard stare"]
> >
> >
> >> ---------------------- Information from the mail
> >> header -----------------------
> >> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >> Poster:       "David A. Daniel" <dad at POKERWIZ.COM>
> >> Subject:      Submariner [was "thousand-yard stare"]
> >>
> >
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ---
> >>
> >> A friend of mine who entered the Naval Academy in about 1968 and, upon
> >> graduation, went into submarine service, and spent his career in
> >> submarines,
> >> told me in no uncertain terms that sub-mariner was considered an insult
> >> of
> >> the thems-fightin-words variety, the proper term being submarine-er. I
> >> don't
> >> know about WW II, but it seems odd the attitude re pronunciation
> >> preference
> >> would have been different, given the beneath-a-mariner implication of
> the
> >> former. No? (History and Discovery Channels are always saying
> >> sub-mariner.
> >> Surprising no one has corrected them.)
> >> DAD
> >>
> >> If a vegetarian eats vegetables, what does a humanitarian eat?
> >>
> >>
> >>> (Back During The War, there was a
> >>>sea-dwelling superhero named "SubMARiner" and the crew of a submarine
> >>>were also subMARiners. Nowadays, "submaRINer" appears to have become
> >>>the norm.)
> >>
> >> -Wilson
> >>
> >> On Tue, Jul 27, 2010 at 7:20 AM, Mark Mandel <thnidu at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>
> >
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> ---
> >>>
> >>> "thousand-parsec stare" gets about 9 rgh, all fairly recent I think.
> >>> Looks
> >>> like it's gotten well established in sf. Of course it could easily have
> >> bee=
> >>> n
> >>> independently reinvented.
> >>>
> >>> m a m
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 5:05 PM, Wilson Gray <hwgray at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> FWIW, at one time, "thousand-yard stare" was so hip that a
> >>>> science-fiction author whose name I can no longer recall used it in
> >>>> the modified form, "thousand-parsec stare" in a story whose title I
> >>>> can no longer recall in an sf mag whose name I can no longer recall.
> >>>>
> >>>> Photos of the thousand-yard stare by David Douglas Duncan
> >>>>
> >>>> http://www.hrc.utexas.edu/collections/photography/holdings/
> >>>>
> >>>> http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0405/ddd01.html
> >>>>
> >>>> -Wilson
> >>>>
> >>>> On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 10:56 AM, Jonathan Lighter
> >>>> <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>> >
> >>>>
> >>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------=
> >>> ------
> >>>> >
> >>>> > The appearance - in big print - in Harper's must have helped assure
> >>>> > the
> >>>> > term's permamence.
> >>>> >
> >>>> > JL
> >>>> >
> >>>> > On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 10:31 AM, Mullins, Bill AMRDEC <
> >>>> > Bill.Mullins at us.army.mil> wrote:
> >>>> >
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >>
> >>>>
> >>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------=
> >>> ------
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
> >>>> >> Caveats: NONE
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> >
> >>>> >> > >
> >>>> >> > >
> >>>> >>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>> >> > ----------
> >>>> >> > >
> >>>> >> > > Should the OED add "thousand-yard stare"?  Wikipedia's article
> >>>> >> > > of
> >>>> >> > > that name dates it to the title of a Life Magazine painting in
> >> 194=
> >>> 4
> >>>> >> > > (although that used "2,000").  Google Books gives about 57
> >>>> >> > > results
> >>>> >> > > before 1951, all snippets, and some journals and so needing
> >>>> >> > verification.
> >>>> >> > >
> >>>> >> > >
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> Wikipedia was wrong (surprise!).  Tom Lea's painting appears in the
> >> Ju=
> >>> ne
> >>>> >> 11 1945 issue of Life:
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >>
> >>>>
> >>
> http://books.google.com/books?id=3D_EkEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=3DPA61&dq=3D%22tom%20=
> >>> lea%2
> >>>> >>
> >> 2&as_pt=3DMAGAZINES&pg=3DPA65#v=3Donepage&q=3D%22tom%20lea%22&f=3Dfals=
> >>> e
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> and is not titled there.   I've tried to straighten up the wiki a
> >>>> >> little, but it would take a bigger re-write than I will do to
> really
> >> f=
> >>> ix
> >>>> >> it.
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> Legit 1944 cites:
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> [no author given; interview with George E. Jones, UP war
> >> correspondent=
> >>> ]
> >>>> >> "War Reporter Home to Rest,"_Oregonian_ [Portland OR] 4/6/1944 p 9
> >> col=
> >>>  2
> >>>> >> "And they have that 'thousand-yard stare' a look of utter fatigue,
> >>>> >> as
> >> =
> >>> if
> >>>> >> somebody had placed a film over their eyes."
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> Hansford Martin, "Thousand-yard stare"  [short story] _Harper's
> >>>> >> Magazine_ v. 189 (November 1944) p. 523-8
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
> >>>> >> Caveats: NONE
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>> >> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>>> >>
> >>>> >
> >>>> >
> >>>> >
> >>>> > --
> >>>> > "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
> >>>> truth."
> >>>> >
> >>>> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>>> >
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> -Wilson
> >>>> =E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93
> >>>> All say, "How hard it is that we have to die!"=E2=80=93=E2=80=93a
> >> strange=
> >>>  complaint to
> >>>> come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
> >>>> =E2=80=93Mark Twain
> >>>>
> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> -Wilson
> >> ---
> >> All say, "How hard it is that we have to die!"--a strange complaint to
> >> come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
> >> -Mark Twain
> >>
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