up-state/down-state

[Dan Goncharoff]

My view is that in NY state, between NYC+LI and Albany, "upstate" is north
and west of wherever you're from.

Jstor has an interesting article presenting a specific definition:

http://www.jstor.org/pss/486854
<http://www.jstor.org/pss/486854>
Pronunciation in Downstate New York (I)
C. K. Thomas
American Speech
Vol. 17, No. 1 (Feb., 1942), pp. 30-41

It looks like this is an ADS publication.

It defines "downstate" as the five counties of NYC plus Nassau to its east.
Suffolk County, the eastern part of Long Island, is considered not part of
"downstate", because it is rural, and its speech patterns are closer to CT.

DanG

On Wed, May 18, 2011 at 1:40 PM, Michael Newman
<michael.newman at qc.cuny.edu>wrote:

> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
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> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Michael Newman <michael.newman at QC.CUNY.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: up-state/down-state
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Downstate Medical Center is in Brooklyn for what it's worth.
>
>
> http://www.downstate.edu/
>
> For me, NYC and LI constitute Downstate NY. The term's not used all that
> much, but it still is there ready and available.
>
>
> Michael Newman
> Associate Professor of Linguistics
> Queens College/CUNY
> michael.newman at qc.cuny.edu
>
>
>
> On May 18, 2011, at 1:07 PM, victor steinbok wrote:
>
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> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Poster:       victor steinbok <aardvark66 at GMAIL.COM>
> > Subject:      Re: up-state/down-state
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > I second that, although it's not just "the" major city. Both Burlington
> > (major city) and Montpelier (capital and a major insurance center,
> perhaps
> > third after Hartford and SF) are up north (or, at least, more north than
> > south). So are Barre and Middlebury. In fact, there are no major
> population
> > centers /at all/ below Rutland, which is almost exactly in the middle.
> But
> > this may make Rutland "downstate"--nothing "below" it.
> >
> > I am not convinced that NY is as simple as it sounds--or, as simple as
> > Illinois (and, like I said earlier, I don't recall anyone ever referring
> to
> > "upstate" Illinois, although I only lived in Chicago for two years and in
> > Wisconsin another three). As for NY, I was told by NY (not NYC, but
> perhaps
> > suburban) residents that Westchester Co. is /definitely/ not
> downstate--it's
> > just Westchester. Nor is NYC or Long Island. On the other hand, Syracuse,
> > Utica and Plattsburg are definitely upstate. Not sure about Albany,
> > Schenectady and Poughkeepsie--I thought Binghamton and Poughkeepsie were
> > downstate, but I could be wrong, but, I pretty sure, Rochester was
> included
> > in "upstate". I'm just reporting what I was told--no real opinion on the
> > matter.
> >
> > VS-)
> >
> > On Wed, May 18, 2011 at 12:34 PM, Shapiro, Fred <fred.shapiro at yale.edu
> >wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Isn't the major city in Vermont very much in the north?
> >>
> >> Fred Shapiro
> >>
> >>
> >
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