1947 citing in Archie Comic of "butthole." What did it mean?

[Ben Zimmer]

Further discussion by James McElvenny on Fully (sic), an Australian linguablog:

http://blogs.crikey.com.au/fullysic/2012/04/27/kind-of-butthole/


On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 1:29 PM, Jonathan Lighter
<wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Allow me to recommend HDAS as a more informative source for "bunghole"
> than the unrevised OED.
>
> I'll also qualify my previous answer. "Bunghole" would be acceptable in
> a cartoon if it referred to the hole in a barrel.  But even the slightest
> suggestion of an anatomical meaning would not have passed.
>
> How common was it in the U.S. to refer to a barrel as a "butt"?  I'd think
> it was very rare outside the industry.
>
> But the real mysteries for me are how Montana's word got printed and why
> anatomical "butthole" was so uncommon before the 1960s.
>
> SWAG:  It was used primarily in the South and Midwest, which were short on
> both naturalistic novelists and unflinching dialectologists. Also, IIRC,
> even naturalistic novels are scanty on that kind of reference until the
> '60s and '70s.  But that doesn't explain what it was doing in "Archie."
>
> JL
>
> On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 12:56 PM, Jonathan Lighter
> <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > -----------------------
> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> > Subject:      Re: 1947 citing in Archie Comic of "butthole." What did it
> > mean?
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > 1. No.
> >
> > 2. No.
> >
> > 3. Yes.
> >
> > 4. Possibly, but I'd think it wouldn't.
> >
> > "Bunghole" is not used predicatively either.
> >
> > JL
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 12:46 PM, Joel S. Berson <Berson at att.net> wrote:
> >
> > > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > > -----------------------
> > > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > > Poster:       "Joel S. Berson" <Berson at ATT.NET>
> > > Subject:      Re: 1947 citing in Archie Comic of "butthole." What did
> > > it
> > > mean?
> > >
> > >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > At 4/25/2012 10:01 AM, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
> > > > >  Is there any possibility that "butthole" could have meant "bottom
> > > > > of
> > > the
> > > >barrel"?
> > >
> > > A la "bung-hole", which JL mentions casually below but astonishingly
> > > does not call attention to?
> > >
> > > 1)  Did "bung-hole" ever mean "disagreeable"?  Or whatever Archie
> > > meant by "Oh, it gets kinda butthole at times."
> > >
> > > 2)  Could someone possibly have transformed "bung-hole" into
> > > "butthole"?
> > >
> > > 3)  That still leaves questions, including how it got past the
> > > censors.
> > >
> > > 4)  Even "bung-hole" might not have passed the censors -- it was used
> > > to mean "anus" in a 1611 dictionary, in the definition of a type of
> > > fish, so presumably it was well-understood in that sense then.  (But
> > > apparently not used later, I conclude from the absence of additional
> > > quotations in the OED.)
> > >
> > > Joel
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >It all depends on what "means" means.  If it means, "What did it mean
> > > > to
> > > >Bob Montana?" I think we have to say that we have no idea beyond
> > > >"disagreeable (in some unspecified way)," and we believe that solely
> > from
> > > >context. Remember, Montana is the only person in human history known
> > > > to
> > > >have used "butthole" predicatively, and even he only printed it (God
> > knows
> > > >how) one time.
> > > >
> > > >If we take the strip at face value, either it was a word-and-meaning
> > that
> > > >Montana overheard and innocently chose to pass on, or else he
> > > > invented
> > it
> > > >for the sake of the strip.  The latter seems awfully unlikely,
> > > > because
> > it
> > > >implies an awareness that "butthole" has negative associations. It
> > > >certainly would be a coincidence if Montana had coined a word from
> > > > whole
> > > >cloth that later became a common vulgarism.
> > > >
> > > >If the photo images show what loggers seem to have referred to
> > technically
> > > >as a "butthole," that would essentially prove a pre-1904 currency of
> > > > the
> > > >anatomical term.  But maybe the photographers just thought it looked
> > like
> > > >  butthole to them.
> > > >
> > > >Or did the appearance of a perfectly innocent "butthole" in "Archie"
> > > >actually introduce the word into American speech via a million
> > > dirty-minded
> > > >teenagers?
> > > >
> > > >Sounds crazy and undoubtedly *is* crazy.  However, not even Berrey &
> > > > Van
> > > >den Bark's 1942/43 _American Thesaurus of Slang_, compiled in
> > > > big-city
> > Los
> > > >Angeles in Montana's home state of California, lists "butthole" in
> > > > any
> > > >sense.
> > > >
> > > >Besides "ass" and "butt" itself, it does contain, on p. 151,
> > > >"Ass-hole...bum-hole, bung-hole,...a-hole" and even the
> > > > extraordinarily
> > > >uncommon (and possibly erroneous) "slop chute."
> > > >
> > > >The absence of "butthole" is certainly strange. But it could have
> > > > been
> > an
> > > >oversight.
> > > >
> > > >As for the willful suppression of vulgar associations, I'm still
> > > > amazed
> > by
> > > >the innocuousness of "male" and "female" "screws."
> > > >
> > > >When I was a UFO buff in the 1960s, I learned that sometimes *no*
> > > >explanation seems to make sense. For now, this appears to be one of
> > those
> > > >cases.
> > > >

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