"Don't let the bastards get you down!" 1945

[Jonathan Lighter]

But now you're talking meter, not grammar.

Also, ISTR that some sources cite Cato as having said "Carthago est
delenda!" which is more emphatic, and thus - to my ear - more likely to
have been his preference.  Any old sentence could end with a form of _esse_.

JL
On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 7:50 PM, Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu>wrote:

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> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: "Don't let the bastards get you down!" 1945
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> On May 21, 2012, at 5:43 PM, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
>
> > But isn't it true that the Romans made gerundive constructions snappier
> by
> > dropping the conjugated form of _esse_?
>
> Snappier, perhaps, but not for the likes of Cato:  "Carthago delenda est"!
>  "Carthago delenda" wouldn't have had the same ring.  And destroyed
> Carthage certainly was, so it must have been snappy enough.
>
> LH
> >
> > Anyway, my high-school Latin teacher (ca1964) was familiar with one form
> of
> > the phrase ("Illegitimis non carborundum," IIRC, but don't quote me),
> which
> > he associated with his Army service in WW2.
> >
> > JL
> >
> > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 5:27 PM, Eric Nielsen <ericbarnak at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
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> >> Poster:       Eric Nielsen <ericbarnak at GMAIL.COM>
> >> Subject:      Re: "Don't let the bastards get you down!" 1945
> >>
> >>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> Possibility: Illegitimis non carborundum est. Dative of agent
> (illegitimis)
> >> used with the passive periphrastic (carborundum is a gerundive)
> >> construction. At least that's how one of my Latin professors solved the
> >> puzzle when I asked her about the more common variant, "Illegitimi non
> >> carborundum"--which I just couldn't parse.
> >>
> >> Eric
> >>
> >> On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 11:35 AM, Baker, John <JBAKER at stradley.com>
> wrote:
> >>
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> >>> Poster:       "Baker, John" <JBAKER at STRADLEY.COM>
> >>> Subject:      Re: "Don't let the bastards get you down!" 1945
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>
> >>> So what would the real Latin be?  Enquiring minds want to know.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> John Baker
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
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> >
> > --
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> truth."
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