NYC's Upper, Lower, and mid- East Sides

Joel S. Berson Berson at ATT.NET
Mon Jan 7 18:08:14 UTC 2013

Is there a name for the neighborhood that includes 48th Street
between Fifth and Lexington?  "Turtle Bay" seems to be commonly
defined as "east of Lexington".


At 1/7/2013 12:15 PM, Jesse Sheidlower wrote:
>As a twenty-year resident of Midtown East (or East Midtown), I can
>assure you that it is a real neighborhood and that is really called
>that. There are other neighborhoods in the area (including the ones you
>mentioned, as well as Kips Bay and more diffuse things like "the Sutton
>Place area") too. Agreed that the UES starts at 60th and goes to 96th,
>with its own subneighborhoods (Yorkville, Carnegie Hill, etc. etc.).
>Nowadays--by which I mean at least the last 20 years--the LES is
>regarded as a separate neighborhood from the East Village (or its
>subneighborhoods, like NoHo, Alphabet City, etc.) It would be really
>unusual to regard the East Village as part of the LES. I'd agree that
>the LES would refer to the below-Houston, east-of-Allen area (north of,
>say, East Broadway).
>Maryam Bakht, at Hunter, sent out a questionnaire last month about these
>exact issues. I don't know if she's published the results.
>Jesse Sheidlower
>On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 05:56:20PM +0100, Michael Newman wrote:
> > For me:
> >
> > The Upper East Side is from 60th to 96th. Above that is East
> Harlem. East Side is just a vague way of saying east of 5th Avenue
> above Washington Square and Bway below it. There is no neighborhood
> called "The East Side"
> > The Lower East Side is ambiguous. Some days it's below 14th St,
> but other days the East Village gets in the way, and in that case,
> it's below Houston and east more or less of Allen. The question is
> whether I consider the East Village part of the LES, which is a
> variable for me. Actually, Kara Becker has a great discussion of
> this in her 2010 NYU Diss, which I hope she publishes one day. The
> basic idea is that the whole East Village area was once part of the
> LES until real estate interests promoted the name East Village
> during the late 60s if I remember right. As far as I know the Upper
> East Side hasn't changed in my lifetime.
> >
> > There is no Mid East Side. There is talk now of Midtown East, but
> that seems recent to me. Traditional names are Turtle Bay, Gramercy
> Park, and Murray Hill, all of which are distinct neighborhoods, all
> of which are in what might be thought of generally as Midtown East.
> >
> > BTW, the Upper West Side goes right up to about 110st, and of
> course there is no Lower West Side.
> >
> >
> >
> > Michael Newman
> > Associate Professor of Linguistics
> > Queens College/CUNY
> > michael.newman at
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 7, 2013, at 5:18 PM, "Joel S. Berson" <Berson at ATT.NET> wrote:
> >
> > > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> -----------------------
> > > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > > Poster:       "Joel S. Berson" <Berson at ATT.NET>
> > > Subject:      NYC's Upper, Lower, and mid- East Sides
> > >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Where did New Yorkers use to place, and where do they now place --
> > >
> > > the Upper East Side?  Do I correctly remember a definition of "above
> > > 96th Street"?
> > >
> > > the Lower East Side?  Below what?
> > >
> > > the mid East Side?  And what term is used for that region?  (Aside
> > > from "the fashionable East Side".)
> > >
> > > Joel

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