Earliest Known Occurrence of the Term "Hot Dog" Pushed Back to 1886, (Corrected Citation)

[sclements at NEO.RR.COM]

If everyone goes back and reads Fred's complete article, you'll find conflicting evidence for the answers.

>>>>>>>>>>"Hot stuff," "hot pup," "hot dog," sings out the fiend who carries in one hand a
tin cooking arrangement, and on the other arm a basket.  He is the wiener wurst
fiend.  It is his cries that greet you as you enter the theater and regreet you
as you come out.  He is the creature whose rolls make night hideous, and whose
wares make dreams that poison sleep.  The luxury came originally from Austria.
Wiener means little and generally speaking, the purchaser gets a little the
wurst of it.  (No diagram of this joke.)  Wurst means, in English, sausage; so
that when one of these peddlers says wiener wurst to you he means do you want a
little sausage.  The tin vessel which he carries is divided into two
compartments.  The upper is filled with water, in which are about a thousand,
more or less, skin sausages.  In the lower apartment is the alcohol stove that
keeps the sausages hot.  In the basket he keeps his rye bread and horse-radish.
The sausage, sandwiched by two slices of bread !
 which have been smeared with the horse-radish, make up the wiener wurst, which
costs you a nickel.  Since Shakespeare asserted that nectar was the food the
gods lived on, it has been discovered that wiener wurst is the stuff that
fattens dudes.  The young men who sell the article are, as a rule, not modest. <<<<<<

First it says  "He is the creature whose rolls make night hideous" and then contradicts by saying "In the basket he keeps his rye bread and horse-radish.  The sausage, sandwiched by two slices of bread !"

So, there's bread of some form in the basket.  I personally doubt they had rolls as the last reference to two slices of bread is pretty specific.

Sam Clements.

---- Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> The basket could be for papers.
>
> JL
>
> On Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 11:49 AM, David A. Daniel <dad at pokerwiz.com> wrote:
>
> > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > -----------------------
> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Poster:       "David A. Daniel" <dad at POKERWIZ.COM>
> > Subject:      Re: Earliest Known Occurrence of the Term "Hot Dog" Pushed
> > Back
> >               to 1886, (Corrected Citation)
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > The sausages are in the top part of the cooking thing, in the water, being
> > or to be cooked, the alcohol burner being in the lower part. Basket gotta
> > be
> > for buns. BTW, snub is buns spelled backwards.
> > DAD
> >
> >
> > To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Earliest Known Occurrence of the Term "Hot Dog" Pushed Back to
> > 1886, (Corrected Citation)
> >
> > Poster:       "Joel S. Berson" <Berson at ATT.NET>
> > Subject:      Re: Earliest Known Occurrence of the Term "Hot Dog" Pushed
> > Back
> >               to 1886, (Corrected Citation)
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ---
> >
> > At 1/22/2013 10:07 AM, Dan Goncharoff wrote:
> > >Isn't that what the basket was for? The rolls?
> > >
> > >>the fiend who carries in one hand a tin cooking arrangement, and on the
> > >>other arm a basket.
> >
> > Where did the fiend carry the yet-to-be-cooked wursts? In the "tin
> > cooking arrangement"? (And if there were no rolls, I suspect not
> > wrapped in wax paper -- see below -- but, like fish and chips, in
> > probably-cheaper newspaper -- after all, it was called the "penny press".)
> >
> > Joel
> >
> >
> > > > <snip>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >DanG
> > >
> > >
> > >On Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 9:17 AM, Jonathan Lighter
> > ><wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com>wrote:
> > >
> > > > Subject:      Re: Earliest Known Occurrence of the Term "Hot Dog"
> > Pushed
> > > > Back
> > > >               to 1886, (Corrected Citation)
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ---
> > > >
> > > > Good point, Amy.  And  no rolls are mentioned. Were the dogs sold
> > wrapped
> > > > in waxed paper?
> > > >
> > > > JL
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 9:07 AM, Amy West <medievalist at w-sts.com>
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Poster:       Amy West <medievalist at W-STS.COM>
> > > > > Subject:      Re: Earliest Known Occurrence of the Term "Hot Dog"
> > Pushed
> > > > > Back
> > > > >               to 1886,        (Corrected Citation)
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ---
> > > > > > From:    "Shapiro, Fred"<fred.shapiro at YALE.EDU>
> > > > > > Subject: Earliest Known Occurrence of the Term "Hot Dog" Pushed
> > Back
> > to
> > > > > 1886
> > > > > >           (Corrected Citation)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The Tennessee provenance of the term "hot dog" now seems stronger,
> > as I
> > > > > have found an 1886 citation from that state:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > hot dog (OED 1892)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 1886_Nashville Tennessean_  14 Nov. 9/2 (ProQuest Historical
> > > > Newspapers)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "Hot stuff," "hot pup," "hot dog," sings out the fiend who carries
> > in
> > > > > one hand a tin cooking arrangement, and on the other arm a basket.
> > > > > <snip>
> > > > > >    Wiener means little and generally speaking, the purchaser gets a
> > > > > little the wurst of it.  (No diagram of this joke.)  Wurst means, in
> > > > > English, sausage; so that when one of these peddlers says wiener
> > wurst
> > to
> > > > > you he means do you want a little sausage.  The tin vessel which he
> > > > carries
> > > > > is divided into two compartments.  The upper is filled with water, in
> > > > which
> > > > > are about a thousand, more or less, skin sausages.  In the lower
> > > > apartment
> > > > > is the alcohol stove that keeps the sausages hot.
> > > > > >
> > > > > Here's what intrigues me: the equivalence of "wiener" with little.
> > Are
> > > > > they falsely analogizing by/playing on "wee"? They get "wurst" right,
> > so
> > > > > something's going on with "wiener." And the mention of "a thousand"
> > may
> > > > > be exaggeration, but still indicates a small size. So, I'm inferring
> > > > > that in this appearance, they're very much like what we still call
> > > > > "Vienna sausages".
> > > > >
> > > > > ---Amy West

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