_Canvass_ > "examine, pore over, search"

Fri Apr 18 12:15:43 UTC 2014

It hasn't been hurt by the fact that for at least several centuries, no
connection between the noun "canvass" and *any* of the meanings in question
has been obvious.

So the Rohrschach principle of semantic change kicks in: "I don't know what
the hell it means exactly, so why not this?!"

JL

On Thu, Apr 17, 2014 at 8:15 PM, Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu>wrote:

> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: _Canvass_ > "examine, pore over, search"
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> The really fun part of the OED entry for _canvass_ (which inspired me to
> use it in a class exercise to demonstrate semantic change) is the history,
> from canvas (the cloth) to the use of canvas sheets for fun and torture
> back in the early 16th c.:
>
> 1. To toss in a canvas sheet, etc., as a sport or punishment; to blanket.
> Obs.
> �To knock about, shake and shatter thoroughly; to buffet; to beat, batter,
> drub.
>
> By the late 16th c. this began to allow for metaphorical readings, but the
> route from tossing someone in a canvas sheet or thrashing them to surveying
> a region to soliciting votes is pretty interesting.  Warning: tracking the
> history may provide an unfortunate reminder of the 2000 presidential
> election.
>
> LH
>
>
>
> On Apr 17, 2014, at 7:41 PM, Joel S. Berson wrote:
>
> > At 4/17/2014 03:37 PM, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
> >
> >> OED does a very poor job on police "canvassing the neighborhood." In
> fact,
> >> it's not there at all, unless you're happy with 7b, "To sue or solicit
> >> (persons, a district) for votes, subscriptions, custom, orders, etc."
> >>
> >> See, "etc." could include "information." Works for me. Not.
> >
> > It works for me with "information", but not with the OEDs verbs (sue,
> > solicit).  My notion of (the sense in question here of) "canvass" is
> > "to search, inquire, for information".  Similar to Jon's Subject line
> > (but more with the sense of "seeking" than "examining"), and to Dan's
> > comment further below.  And different from the 4.b Jon cites next;
> > "investigate" is OK; "physically" to restrictive: canvassed
> > information can come from speech also.
> >
> >
> >> As for the defined sense, "To investigate or examine physically" (4b),
> it
> >> is clearly marked "Obs.," with a single citation from 1652. Nada since.
> >> Odds that Wilson's cited journalist learned this usage in an unbroken
> and
> >> unrecorded line from the mid-17th century: zero.
> >>
> >> Moreover, the new example is closer in meaning to "search (an area)
> >> carefully and methodically" than it is to "investigate or examine
> >> physically," which is what the Spanish explorer Francisco de Ulloa was
> >> doing, no more and no less, in Peter Heylen's 1652  _Cosmographie_ as he
> >> *explored* what is now called the Sea of Cortez:
> >
> > "Search for information" again.
> >
> > Joel
> >
> >
> >> "The business having slept a while, was in the year 1539 awakened by
> >> *Francisco
> >> de Vlloa,* one that had accompanied *Cortez* the time before: who did
> not
> >> only search to the bottom of the *Gulf,* but having thorowly canvassed
> all
> >> the Eastern shores, he turned his course, and made as fortunate a
> Discovery
> >> also of the VVestern coasts."
> >>
> >> Heylen used "canvass" rather often, usually in the sense of "to
> discuss."
> >>
> >> To "investigate or explore (physically)" is a plausible early meaning of
> >> "to discuss," though the OED (which see) does not say so.
> >>
> >> JL
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 5:52 PM, Dan Goncharoff <thegonch at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >> > -----------------------
> >> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >> > Poster:       Dan Goncharoff <thegonch at GMAIL.COM>
> >> > Subject:      Re: _Canvass_ > "examine, pore over, search"
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >
> >> > There is an older meaning of canvass that means to search or
> scrutinize.
> >> > Back in the 19th century, it was the first meaning. Check the 1828
> >> > Webster's.
> >> >
> >> > DanG
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 8:57 PM, Wilson Gray <hwgray at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >> > > -----------------------
> >> > > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >> > > Poster:       Wilson Gray <hwgray at GMAIL.COM>
> >> > > Subject:      Re: _Canvass_ > "examine, pore over, search"
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> > >
> >> > > On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 8:12 PM, Jonathan Lighter <
> >> > wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com
> >> > > >wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > > "canvass the area"
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > That's a clip of "canvass, i.e. "interview," the [residents of] the
> area
> >> > > [to see what, if anything, they know about the crime]." Since
> deserts are
> >> > > called "deserts" because they're deserted, I can't wrap my mind
> around
> >> > the
> >> > > concept of "canvassing" a desert to see what, if anything, it knows
> about
> >> > > the  location of the body of a murder victim or for anything else
> that it
> >> > > may know. Others may not have this problem.
> >> > >
> >> > > Youneverknow.
> >> > >
> >> > > --
> >> > > -Wilson
> >> > > -----
> >> > > All say, "How hard it is that we have to die!"---a strange
> complaint to
> >> > > come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
> >> > > -Mark Twain
> >> > >
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> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
> truth."
> >>
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