buck, n.9 (token in poker) -- quotations and definition in OED2

[Joel S. Berson]

At 1/15/2014 12:53 PM, W Brewer wrote:
>DG: <<Because the dealer also plays, putting the deck down to examine his
>cards.>>
>WB:  Dealer puts the deck down, in plain sight, right in front of herself.
>Question remains:  Is the "buck knife (handle)" in poker a MERE
>folk-etymology, or is it actually ATTESTED in USE?)

Responding, and also supplementing (and not conflicting with) Doug
Wilson's message (I haven't looked into the 2005 archives) -- from the OED:

Yes "buck" and "knife" are attested.  "Buck knife" specifically is not.

"buck, n.9" (for poker) has four quotations, starting in 1865 (New
Mexico).  Perhaps interestingly, this is just 10 years later than the
earliest quotation for "buck, n.8" = dollar.  I'm imagining
'49ers.  The next quotation comes from an undisputable authority
(Mark Twain, 1872); the last two from "dictionaries" (books
describing the practice of poker).  One of these two says "usually
knife or pencil", the other "pocket-knife".

Both "buck" entries are OED2, so the mines may have garnered additional ore.

Also, readers and poker players may be interested in the OED's
definition for the poker buck -- "U.S. In the game of poker, any
article placed in the pool with the chips."  From what I read here,
some players would not agree.  However, the OED's quotations seem to
disagree with each other (or describe variant uses of the buck) --
three say it's "passed", but the following seems consonant with but
more detailed than the OED definition:

1887   J. W. Keller Game of Draw Poker 38   They resort to the bold
and ludicrous experiment of 'passing the buck'. The 'buck' is any
inanimate object, usually knife or pencil, which is thrown into a
jack pot and temporarily taken by the winner of the pot. Whenever the
deal reaches the holder of the 'buck', a new jack pot must be made.

Disclosure:  I am not a poker player.

Joel

>JL:  <<More appropriate for a horse-laugh on the Pecos>>
>WB: Haha! Good one!
>
>
>On Thu, Jan 16, 2014 at 1:35 AM, Dan Goncharoff <thegonch at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > -----------------------
> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Poster:       Dan Goncharoff <thegonch at GMAIL.COM>
> > Subject:      Re: impactful, below-the-line, etc.
> >
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Because the dealer also plays, putting the deck down to examine his cards.
> >
> > Knowing who is dealer is important because the dealer pays the entire ante.
> >
> > DanG
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jan 15, 2014 at 12:26 PM, W Brewer <brewerwa at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > > -----------------------
> > > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > > Poster:       W Brewer <brewerwa at GMAIL.COM>
> > > Subject:      Re: impactful, below-the-line, etc.
> > >
> > >
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > RE: buck or buck knife or buck knife handle as poker dealer indicator.
> > > Seems to me, whoever is holding the deck tells you who the dealer is. Why
> > > would you need any further indication? (I.e., is the "buck" in poker a
> > mere
> > > folk-etymology, or is it actually attested in use?)
> > > {The buck stops here} sign = there is no further bucking (i.e. evasion)
> > of
> > > responsibility at this desk.

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