[Ads-l] Major Discovery Relating to "Whole Nine Yards"

[ADSGarson O'Toole]

The 1895 comical poem that appeared in "The Atlanta Constitution" was
reprinted in other periodicals. See below.

The humorous verse included the line "He wrote a poem six yards long"
about a violet. A measurement in yards was often specified for
fabrics. Indeed, the work contained the funny revelation that the poem
"Was cloth--from Sallie's hat!"

In 1896 "The Atlanta Constitution" printed the following passage:

[Begin excerpt]
"A song beats a sigh," says a poet. But that depends. Suppose a song
is six yards long?
[End excerpt]

In 1902 "The Atlanta Constitution" printed the following passage:

[Begin excerpt]
The International Magazine of Billville has out a prospectus nine yards long.
[End excerpt]

Bonnie found a citation from 1907 in Lawrence County, Indiana.

[Begin excerpt]
This afternoon at 2:30 will be called one of the baseball games that
will be worth going a long way to see.  The regular nine is going to
play the business men as many innings as they can, but we can not
promise the full nine yards.
[Begin excerpt]

Perhaps "we can not promise the full nine yards" means "we can not
promise the full inordinately long detailed description of the
baseball game". That use would fit with the use in "The Atlanta
Constitution".

Here are some other periodicals with the 1895 poem.

Date: November 23, 1895
Newspaper: Saturday Globe
Newspaper Location: Utica, New York
Database: Old Fulton

Date: April 15, 1896
Periodical: Farm and Fireside
Quote Page 17
Publisher: P.M. Mast & Co., Springfield, Ohio
Database: Internet Archive

Date: December 18, 1895
Newspaper: The Lenoir Topic
Newspaper Location: Lenoir, North Carolina
Database: Newspapers.com

Here is the version published in Saint Paul, Minnesota. The poem was
nearly identical and the Atlanta Constitution was acknowledged.

Date: December 9, 1895
Newspaper: The Saint Paul Globe
Newspaper Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota
Quote Page 8
Database: Newspapers.com

[Begin excerpt]
A FLOWERY TRAGEDY.

The poet found a violet
  Upon the frozen way.
Blue-eyed and bright, it charmed his
   sight--
 A memory of May.

He took the outcast to his breast--
  A little pearl of price;
And marveled much at finding such
  A tender flower in ice.

He wrote a poem six yards long:
  His wife--she laid it flat
By saying: "Dear, that violet
  Was cloth--from Sallie's hat!"
            --Atlanta Constitution

[End excerpt]


On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 7:40 PM, Bonnie Taylor-Blake
<b.taylorblake at gmail.com> wrote:
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Bonnie Taylor-Blake <b.taylorblake at GMAIL.COM>
> Subject:      Re: Major Discovery Relating to "Whole Nine Yards"
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I'm not sure that I've been a trailblazer on this front (but thanks
> for that anyway, Fred); it's pretty much that I've been lucky,
> sometimes finding something just barely before any number of you have
> found it yourselves.
>
> I thank Fred, too, for letting me know about this a few days ago.
>
> I think Mr. Bucci's find is very exciting, because to me it does
> indeed hint at the fuller idiom.  It's not just how "your [last] 'nine
> yards'" is used, but also -- as Fred has mentioned -- how "nine yards"
> has been set within quotation marks.  (It also tends to support the
> theory that the earliest forms of the idiom for the most part seem to
> allude to lengthy oral or written presentations, which is something I
> lean toward.)
>
> I've tried to track down Edwin Draper's comments in "the Record,"
> which Kennedy alludes to in an earlier piece [1], because I think it
> would be helpful to see what Kennedy was responding to.  In other
> words, what exactly about Draper's commentary or notice made it his
> "'nine yards'"?
>
> On the other hand, it occurs to me that we can't rule out the slight
> chance that Kennedy is simply quoting from Draper; perhaps Draper had
> earlier used "nine yards" in a piece appearing in "the Record" and
> that Kennedy is merely repeating Draper's earlier usage of the
> apparent idiom.
>
> Trouble is, I can't figure out what "the Record" was.  Was it a
> newspaper or similar local publication?  (Draper looks to have been a
> Whig; could the Record have been a Whig newspaper?)  I hope someone
> else has success with this.
>
> To my mind (for what it's worth), there's still not enough to tell us
> whether Kennedy's use of "nine yards" was ultimately based on
> something tangible or whether it was just a colorful expression.  And
> I try not to dwell on that issue of origin, because it always drives
> me a little nuts.  Instead, I'm fine with waiting for still earlier
> sightings along the lines of Mr. Bucci's that may give us better
> clues.
>
> Anyway, my thanks go to Fred, for passing this along, and to Mr. Bucci
> for sending it to Fred.
>
> -- Bonnie
>
>
> [1] http://tinyurl.com/ptfu93v
>
> MR. EDITOR, -- I ask your indulgence for the use of your columns, for
> the purpose of answering the assertions made against me in a
> communication in the Record of 20th Sept., signed "Common Sense,"
> alias "Old Ball," alias "Edwin Draper."  As he has made as near a
> personal matter as he could well, I shall treat it as such in part at
> least, as I come in for a good share of his malice in his
> communication.
>
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