[Ads-l] when = 'if'

[Neal Whitman]

All of these examples strike me as the same kind of individual-level 
predicate humorously interpreted as a stage-level predicate, also 
exemplified in the phrase "driving while black."

Neal

On 9/29/2015 2:57 PM, Laurence Horn wrote:
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: when = 'if'
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>> On Sep 29, 2015, at 2:35 PM, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM> =
> wrote:
>> =20
>> You're absolutely right, Ben. At least it's "if" in this version.
>> =20
>> But the major point stands.  I've heard the "when" usage a number of =
> times,
>> though only in humorous contexts, likely just within this decade.
>> =20
>> JL
> Only the "when you're a cat" example (if it had been a "when you're a =
> cat" example, which I agree it could have been) is humorous; the other =
> non-temporal cases of "when you're ..." cases, with "...a woman", =
> "blind", etc. (and with impersonal subjects and generic readings, and no =
> implications of "sometimes you aren't") are serious and entirely =
> natural, at least for me.
>
> LH
>> =20
>> On Tue, Sep 29, 2015 at 2:16 PM, Ben Zimmer <bgzimmer at gmail.com> =
> wrote:
>> =20
>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>> -----------------------
>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>> Poster:       Ben Zimmer <bgzimmer at GMAIL.COM>
>>> Subject:      Re: when =3D 'if'
>>> =20
>>> =
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------=
> -----
>>> =20
>>> On Tue, Sep 29, 2015 at 1:55 PM, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
>>>> =20
>>>> OED when, def. 8a ends by saying "sometimes nearly =3D 'if.'"
>>>> =20
>>>> Cites go back to ca1175.
>>>> =20
>>>> There is, however what I take to be a recent usage that goes further =
> and
>>>> essentially equals "if."
>>>> =20
>>>> Current TV commercial:
>>>> =20
>>>> "When you're a cat, you ignore people. It's what you do."
>>>> =20
>>>> I.e., you ignore people "if" you're a cat. "When" implies there are =
> times
>>>> when you're not.
>>>> =20
>>>> Which is never, if you're a cat.
>>> =20
>>> I think you might have misheard that, Jon. Sounds like "if" to me:
>>> =20
>>> =
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.youtube.com_wat=
> ch-3Fv-3DKk-5F6-5FVhwijA&d=3DAwIBaQ&c=3D-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=3DwFp3X4M=
> u39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=3Ds0ar5C0SR85JlyznQ3AtNLaMf8t5eKLyh=
> IIbxuXLdoM&s=3DtcXIfw7l8Mgt5l5Ht_oehLmM_XsvO1TcHmxiEpXMEVw&e=3D=20
>>> =20
>>> It's one of a series of Geico commercials involving versions of the
>>> line, "If you're X, you Y. It's what you do."
>>> =20
>>> --bgz
>>> =20
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>> The American Dialect Society - =
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.americandialect.=
> org&d=3DAwIBaQ&c=3D-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=3DwFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsS=
> xPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=3Ds0ar5C0SR85JlyznQ3AtNLaMf8t5eKLyhIIbxuXLdoM&s=3DAVIWp_=
> h0j6mgw3nU4bv4_-bfgbvXSaBiah0iumAttMo&e=3D=20
>>> =20
>> =20
>> =20
>> =20
>> --=20
>> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the =
> truth."
>> =20
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> The American Dialect Society - =
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.americandialect.=
> org&d=3DAwIBaQ&c=3D-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=3DwFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsS=
> xPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=3Ds0ar5C0SR85JlyznQ3AtNLaMf8t5eKLyhIIbxuXLdoM&s=3DAVIWp_=
> h0j6mgw3nU4bv4_-bfgbvXSaBiah0iumAttMo&e=3D=20
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>

-- 
Dr. Neal Whitman
Lecturer, ESL Composition
School of Teaching and Learning
College of Education and Human Ecology
Arps Hall
1945 North High Street
whitman.11 at osu.edu
(614) 260-1622


------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org