[Ads-l] Toast: Champagne for our real friends, real pain for your sham friends

[ADSGarson O'Toole]

Thanks for your response, Mark. The pun contrasting “champagne” and
“real pain” has a long history which antedates the toast, apparently.
For example, Samuel Foote's play “The Maid of the Bath” performed in
1771 contained the following instance. The characters Major Rackett
and Sir Christopher Cripple were conversing:

[ref] 1778, The Maid of Bath; A Comedy in Three Acts, As It Is
Performed at the Theatre-Royal in the Haymarket, Written by the Late
Samuel Foote, Act 1, Scene 1, Quote Page 7, Published by Mr. Colman,
Printed by T. Sherlock for T. Cadell, London. (Google Books Full View)
link [/ref]

https://books.google.com/books?id=iLFEAAAAYAAJ&q=%22real+pain%22#v=snippet&

[Begin excerpt]
Rack. My dear Sir Kit, for this I merit your thanks: How often Dr.
Carawitchet has told you, rich food and champaigne would produce you
nothing but poor health and real pain!

Sir Chr. Wht signifies the prattle of such a punning puppy as he?
what, I suppose, you would starve me, you scoundrel!
[End excerpt]

Garson

On Thu, Dec 13, 2018 at 11:07 PM Mark Mandel <mark.a.mandel at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> related though not the same: in the song "The Charladies' Ball", which
> shows up with many variations in the lyrics, there're these lines (quoting
> from the version I remember this fragment from, read many years ago):
>
> We had champagne that night and real pain the next morning,
> We danced in our socks at the Charladies' Ball.
>
> Slight variant:
> We had champagne that night but real pains next morning,
>
>
> See:
> • https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Charladies%27_Ball
> • https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=6502
>
> I wonder whether the R. Popock referred to in a couple of your sources is
> related to our own B. Popik.
>
>
> Mark Mandel
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 13, 2018, 2:59 PM ADSGarson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com
> wrote:
>
> > The saying in the subject line is listed in several references and
> > websites such as: Oxford Dictionary of Humorous Quotations, Brewer's
> > Famous Quotations, The Comic Encyclopedia by Evan Esar, The Home Book
> > of Humorous Quotations edited by A. K. Adams, phrases.org.uk,
> > wikiquote.org, brainyquote.com.
> >
> > I was sent a request to explore its provenance. If a list member can
> > find and share a  match before 1793 or other interesting information,
> > it would be appreciated.
> > ...
> > Barry Popik has an entry that begins with an 1809 citation.
> >
> >
> > https://www.barrypopik.com/index.php/new_york_city/entry/champagne_to_our_real_friends_and_real_pain_to_our_sham_friends/
> >
> > ...
>
>
> Here is a match in a work from 1800.
> >
> > [ref] 1800, Pocock's Everlasting Songster: Containing a Selection of
> > the most approved songs, which have been and are likely to be sung for
> > ever with Universal Applause; Also A Collection of Toasts &
> > Sentiments, Quote Page xxi, Printed by R. Popock & Sold by Messrs.
> > Robinson's, Gravesend, England. (Internet Archive at archive.org) link
> > [/ref]
> >
> > https://archive.org/details/pocockseverlasti00pocouoft/page/n25
> >
> > [Begin excerpt]
> > Champaign to our real friends, and real pain to our sham friends.
> > [End excerpt]
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Garson O’Toole
> > QuoteInvestigator.com
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org

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