[Ads-l] ~wool and ~chool

Tom Zurinskas truespel at HOTMAIL.COM
Sat Jul 18 15:10:30 UTC 2020


The problem with English is that the spoken word does not agree with the spelling of it, and thus violates the alphabetic principle that letters stand for sounds.  Here is my vocalizing of ~chooldrin which according to its spelling should be ~children.  I think the reason for saying ~chool (as in "wool') is that it's a little easier than saying ~chil . https://www.speakpipe.com/voice-recorder/msg/1tdziltl77v660rv
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Tom Zurinskas,  Originally from SW Conn 20 yrs,  college NE Tenn 3,  work SE NJ  33,  resides SE Florida 18...  truespel.com

________________________________
From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Geoffrey Nathan <geoffnathan at WAYNE.EDU>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 9:01 PM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Re: ~wool and ~chool

When I taught basic phonology (which I taught from roughly 1975 to 2017)
I usually started with the following set of words:

sit
Sid
hint
pinned
pill

I then pointed out that each "i" sound was different:

sit: short
Sid: long
hint: nasalized, short
pinned: nasalized, long
pill: retracted - not as high, or as front

I then pointed out that these differences didn’t "count", because these
Sounds were allophones of the same phoneme. The retraction is
quite widespread in American English before the dark l in syllable-final
position. I listened to the woman Tom was referencing, and the first
instance is a fairly normal "i", the second one is quite retracted, but
not near the modified "short-u" in "wool".

Not going to measure the formants, but that is my informal assessment.

Geoff

[PS Attempting to fool the software at UGA into not messing up
the formatting]

Geoffrey S. Nathan
WSU Information Privacy Officer (Retired)
Emeritus Professor, Linguistics Program
http://blogs.wayne.edu/proftech/
geoffnathan at wayne.edu

From: Tom Zurinskas<mailto:truespel at HOTMAIL.COM>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 3:23 PM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU<mailto:ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Re: ~wool and ~chool

---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Poster:       Tom Zurinskas <truespel at HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: ~wool and ~chool
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd say the lady speaking here is saying ~chooldrin.   https://www.youtube.=
com/watch?v=3Dz_1Zv_ECy0g  around 20 seconds and 30 s inti video.  I heard =
Lawrence O'Donnel say ~chooldrin on yesterday's show, and he's from Mass.  =
I wool never ceased to be amazed.  ~~fer sher~~

Tom Zurinskas,  Originally from SW Conn 20 yrs,  college NE Tenn 3,  work S=
E NJ  33,  resides SE Florida 18...  truespel.com

________________________________
From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of MULLIN=
S, WILLIAM D (Bill) CIV USARMY CCDC AVMC (USA) <0000099bab68be9a-dmarc-requ=
est at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 7:00 PM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Re: ~wool and ~chool




> The word "children" is being pronounced ~choolddin for the past few years=
 (where ~chool
> rhymes with "wool").

Not by me.
Or by anyone I've ever spoken with.
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The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org


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The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org

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The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org



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