[Ads-l] antedating "cloud nine" "cloud seven"

Thu Nov 12 21:37:30 UTC 2020

Excellent work, Ben.

Here is a pertinent match for "cloud number seven" in July 1937. The
article is about the opposition among moviegoers to "twin bills",
i.e., playing two movies together.

Date: July 25, 1937
Newspaper: The San Francisco Chronicle
Newspaper Location: San Francisco Chronicle
Article: The Double Bill Argument Judiciously Accelerated
(Continuation title: Fan Is Final Film Arbiter)
Author: Maury Campbell
Start Page D1, Quote Page D3, Column 4
Database: GenealogyBank

[Begin excerpt]
Now if Mr. and Mrs. Fan will come down from cloud number seven they
can and will eventually combat any double bill menace. If 60 per cent
of the citizenry really prefers the single bill why not have it?
[End excerpt]

Garson

On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 3:49 PM ADSGarson O'Toole
<adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Great work, JL and DanG.
>
> "The Times" of London published an article about "cloud nine" in 2016
> claiming that it originated in 1896. I have only seen the beginning of
> the article. Others have expressed skepticism about this origin tale.
>
> Newspaper: The Times
> Article: The origin of Cloud 9
> Author: Paul Simons
> Date: September 05 2016
>
> [Begin excerpt]
> An unlikely combination of a Victorian aristocrat and an international
> meteorology meeting 120 years ago led to a well known phrase
> describing a state of euphoria. In September, 1896, cumulonimbus, the
> greatest cloud in the world, was listed as Cloud 9 in a new cloud
> classification, and so to be on cloud nine became like floating on the
> tallest cloud on Earth.
>
> The story began with Sir Ralph Abercromby, who became fascinated by
> meteorology while serving in the British Army. He was forced to retire
> early from the army through ill health, but he was wealthy enough to
> pursue his own research projects into meteorology.
> [End excerpt]
>
> Here is a link to the analysis of "cloud nine" at the Online Etymology
> Dictionary which mentions "Some connect the phrase with the 1895
> International Cloud-Atlas . . .". The website also notes that "The
> phrase might appear in the 1935 aviation-based play 'Ceiling Zero' by
> Frank Wilbur Wead."
>
> https://www.etymonline.com/word/cloud%20nine
>
> Here is information from a Google snippet match within the play "Ceiling Zero".
>
> Date: Circa 1935
> Title: Ceiling Zero: A Play in Three Acts
> Author: Frank Wilber Wead
> Quote Page GB 51
>
> Database: Google Books Snippet Match requires verification. (Search
> for "1935" produces a snippet that says: As presented by Brock
> Pemberton at the Music Box, New York, on April 10 , 1935. Directed by
> Antoinette Perry. Setting designed by John Root.
>
> [Begin extracted text]
> TEX. Dizzy--Mike doesn't know what it's all about He's in Cloud Nine
> or ginned up most of the time.
> DIZZY. (Unbelievingly) Mike Owens shining spittoons!
> [End extracted text]
>
> While searching I also came across the Google Books snippet match in
> "Electrical West" circa 1936-1937 that DanG mentioned. But I also
> noticed that a poster with the handle gnorrn on Reddit found that
> match five years ago. In addition, gnorrn referred to the play
> "Ceiling Zero".
>
> [Begin excerpt]
> Electrical West magazine, San Francisco, 1936, p. 25:
>
> Trouble is, they start rebuilding up on cloud nine instead of digging
> down into the muck and dirt of humanity to bedrock and starting the
> foundations on hard fact
>
> EDIT: found a slightly earlier instance:
>
> Ceiling Zero: a play in three acts, by Frank Wead, copyright 1934.
>
> Mike doesn't know what it's all about. He's in Cloud Nine or ginned up
> most of the time.
>
> This play was made into a 1936 movie of the same name, which could
> have helped popularize the phrase.
> [End excerpt]
>
> Here is an instance in November 1943 of "Cloud 9" referring to a place
> one moves to after death, e.g., a heaven-like location.
>
> Date: November 18, 1943
> Newspaper: San Francisco, California
> Newspaper Location: San Francisco, California
> Article: Pelter's Horse Chilcot Has Found Green Pastures
> Quote Page 2H, Column 7
> Database: GenealogyBank
>
> [Begin excerpt]
> John Pelter must be happy tonight, up there on "Cloud 9." His good
> horse Chilcot has a permanent home, and Chilcot was Pelter's major
> passion. John died August 21 at the age of 80.
> [End excerpt]
>
> It appears that Barry Popik does not have an entry for "cloud nine".
> He does have an article about "I'm on cloud wine".
>
> Garson
>
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 2:56 PM Dan Goncharoff <thegonch at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Google Books has a snippet from the journal Electrical West dated 1936 (but
> > unverified):
> >
> > FOUND INSIDE – PAGE 25
> > Trouble is they start rebuilding up on cloud nine instead of digging down
> > into the muck and dirt of humanity to bed rock and starting the foundations
> > on hard fact.” “But I thought you just said that it was the human
> > weaknesses of men that made ...
> >
> > Electrical West was founded in 1895, so the dating is not unreasonable, and
> > the journal was also from San Francisco.
> >
> > DanG
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 7:31 AM Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > OED: 1959, 1956.
> > >
> > > 1942 _San Francisco Chronicle_ (Dec. 25) 1H: The party would have certainly
> > > heard a loud Brooklyn cheer from  up on cloud nine.
> > >
> > > 1943 _San Francisco Chronicle_ (Apr. 29)  1H:  Discharged from the Navy
> > > because his plasma pressure was somewhere up on cloud seven.
> > >
> > > The underlying metaphor is "high." Hence "elated."
> > >
> > > JL
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> > >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org

------------------------------------------------------------
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