[Ads-l] bawdy = 'rowdily humorous; slapstick'

[Barretts Mail]

I should have included the OED definition, which may account for the difference in opinion:

Of, pertaining to, or befitting a bawd; lewd, obscene, unchaste. (Usually applied to language.)

BB

> On 21 Jan 2021, at 17:14, Barretts Mail <mail.barretts at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Merriam-Webster (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bawdy <https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bawdy>): boisterously or humorously indecent
> Mac dictionary: dealing with sexual matters in a comical way; humorously indecent.
> 
> Both fit for me.
> 
> BB
> 
>> On 21 Jan 2021, at 15:18, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM <mailto:wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>> wrote:
>> 
>> Oooh!  "Entwine"!  Just reading the word gives me a thrill.
>> 
>> Not.
>> 
>> Maybe the term people are groping for (sorry for the indecency) is
>> "suggestive."
>> 
>> So perhaps 'suggestive' is another new meaning of "bawdy."  (Like
>> 'surprised' is the latest meaning of "shocked.")
>> 
>> JL
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 4:37 PM Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu <mailto:laurence.horn at yale.edu>>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> According to the L.A. Times, the key word is “entwine”, from the line
>>> 
>>> ‘I’ll instruct you, like me to entwine; The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus’s
>>> vine’
>>> 
>>> Since as the newspaper helpfully points out,
>>> 
>>> '“entwine” is defined in any dictionary’.
>>> 
>>> —although they acknowledge the sexual allusion is “understated”.
>>> 
>>> So I guess we’re quibbling with that periodical over the threshold of what
>>> counts as “sex”, and therefore as “bawdy”. (I can’t count the number of pix
>>> I’ve received in which two kittens qualify as lying entwined in what I’ve
>>> always taken to be a platonic way.) Maybe it should be the L.A. Times
>>> rather than its N.Y. cousin that qualifies as the Gray Lady.
>>> 
>>> LH
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Jan 21, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM <mailto:wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>>
>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Reading the lyrics reveals nothing bawdy to me (i.e., 'humorously
>>> indecent;
>>>> obscene; lewd'). Nor is the L.A. Times a reliable guide to 18th century
>>>> poesy.
>>>> 
>>>> Anyone capable of writing the lyrics - written for a convivial singers'
>>>> club ("Sons of Harmony") - would know that the myrtle was sacred to
>>> Venus,
>>>> goddess of love, and that Bacchus was the god of wine (in poetic
>>> language,
>>>> often "the vine").
>>>> 
>>>> The singers want the spirit of Anacreon to help them harmonize about love
>>>> and wine in a conventional neo-classic manner, and the beauty of their
>>>> singing is irresistible to the gods. If someone gets horny reading the
>>> poem
>>>> (or singing the song), that's their problem.
>>>> 
>>>> Because if the harmonizers want also to fuck around, they don't say so
>>>> here. And they could easily find ways to do so, with or without
>>> Anacreon's
>>>> assistance.
>>>> 
>>>> JL
>>>> 
>>>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 1:56 PM Barretts Mail <mail.barretts at gmail.com <mailto:mail.barretts at gmail.com>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> FWIW, the Wikipedia article is at
>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anacreontic_Song <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anacreontic_Song> <
>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anacreontic_Song <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anacreontic_Song>>. While frequently
>>> not
>>>>> followed, original research is prohibited on Wikipedia as it is a
>>>>> tertiary-sourced encyclopedia.
>>>>> 
>>>>> The comment about the song being bawdy is not sourced, so that is
>>> original
>>>>> research, but I think "To Anacreon in Heav’n” is clearly bawdy even if
>>>>> judged by today’s standards.
>>>>> 
>>>>> ###
>>>>> "And, besides I'll instruct you, like me, to intwine
>>>>> "The Myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's Vine.”
>>>>> ###
>>>>> 
>>>>> The LA Times says that the song is a paean to drinking and sex (
>>>>> https://tinyurl.com/y4nv6xbp <https://tinyurl.com/y4nv6xbp> <https://tinyurl.com/y4nv6xbp <https://tinyurl.com/y4nv6xbp>>).
>>>>> 
>>>>> Benjamin Barrett (he/his/him)
>>>>> Formerly of Seattle, WA
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 21 Jan 2021, at 04:54, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM <mailto:wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>>
>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Wikipedia considers the turgid English song, "To Anacreon in Heav'n"
>>>>>> (ca.1770), to be "bawdy":
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> "The song, through its bawdy lyrics, gained popularity in London and
>>>>>> elsewhere beyond the Anacreontic Society."
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The lyrics irreverently and humorously imagine the enthusiasm of the
>>> gods
>>>>>> to desert Olympus and join the harmonious singers of the Anacreontic
>>>>>> Society, against the wishes of Zeus.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> (N.b., a Brit at Quora.com <http://quora.com/> assured followers that the U.S. national
>>>>> anthem
>>>>>> was based on a "pornographic song," but nothing could be less
>>>>> pornographic
>>>>>> than a bunch of drunks trying to sing these lyrics to the same melody
>>> as
>>>>>> the "Star-Spangled Banner.")
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> JL
>> 
> 


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