[Ads-l] bawdy = 'rowdily humorous; slapstick'
Barretts Mail
mail.barretts at GMAIL.COM
Fri Jan 22 15:58:10 UTC 2021
I should have included the OED definition, which may account for the difference in opinion:
Of, pertaining to, or befitting a bawd; lewd, obscene, unchaste. (Usually applied to language.)
BB
> On 21 Jan 2021, at 17:14, Barretts Mail <mail.barretts at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Merriam-Webster (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bawdy <https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bawdy>): boisterously or humorously indecent
> Mac dictionary: dealing with sexual matters in a comical way; humorously indecent.
>
> Both fit for me.
>
> BB
>
>> On 21 Jan 2021, at 15:18, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM <mailto:wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>> wrote:
>>
>> Oooh! "Entwine"! Just reading the word gives me a thrill.
>>
>> Not.
>>
>> Maybe the term people are groping for (sorry for the indecency) is
>> "suggestive."
>>
>> So perhaps 'suggestive' is another new meaning of "bawdy." (Like
>> 'surprised' is the latest meaning of "shocked.")
>>
>> JL
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 4:37 PM Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu <mailto:laurence.horn at yale.edu>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> According to the L.A. Times, the key word is “entwine”, from the line
>>>
>>> ‘I’ll instruct you, like me to entwine; The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus’s
>>> vine’
>>>
>>> Since as the newspaper helpfully points out,
>>>
>>> '“entwine” is defined in any dictionary’.
>>>
>>> —although they acknowledge the sexual allusion is “understated”.
>>>
>>> So I guess we’re quibbling with that periodical over the threshold of what
>>> counts as “sex”, and therefore as “bawdy”. (I can’t count the number of pix
>>> I’ve received in which two kittens qualify as lying entwined in what I’ve
>>> always taken to be a platonic way.) Maybe it should be the L.A. Times
>>> rather than its N.Y. cousin that qualifies as the Gray Lady.
>>>
>>> LH
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Jan 21, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM <mailto:wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Reading the lyrics reveals nothing bawdy to me (i.e., 'humorously
>>> indecent;
>>>> obscene; lewd'). Nor is the L.A. Times a reliable guide to 18th century
>>>> poesy.
>>>>
>>>> Anyone capable of writing the lyrics - written for a convivial singers'
>>>> club ("Sons of Harmony") - would know that the myrtle was sacred to
>>> Venus,
>>>> goddess of love, and that Bacchus was the god of wine (in poetic
>>> language,
>>>> often "the vine").
>>>>
>>>> The singers want the spirit of Anacreon to help them harmonize about love
>>>> and wine in a conventional neo-classic manner, and the beauty of their
>>>> singing is irresistible to the gods. If someone gets horny reading the
>>> poem
>>>> (or singing the song), that's their problem.
>>>>
>>>> Because if the harmonizers want also to fuck around, they don't say so
>>>> here. And they could easily find ways to do so, with or without
>>> Anacreon's
>>>> assistance.
>>>>
>>>> JL
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 1:56 PM Barretts Mail <mail.barretts at gmail.com <mailto:mail.barretts at gmail.com>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> FWIW, the Wikipedia article is at
>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anacreontic_Song <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anacreontic_Song> <
>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anacreontic_Song <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anacreontic_Song>>. While frequently
>>> not
>>>>> followed, original research is prohibited on Wikipedia as it is a
>>>>> tertiary-sourced encyclopedia.
>>>>>
>>>>> The comment about the song being bawdy is not sourced, so that is
>>> original
>>>>> research, but I think "To Anacreon in Heav’n” is clearly bawdy even if
>>>>> judged by today’s standards.
>>>>>
>>>>> ###
>>>>> "And, besides I'll instruct you, like me, to intwine
>>>>> "The Myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's Vine.”
>>>>> ###
>>>>>
>>>>> The LA Times says that the song is a paean to drinking and sex (
>>>>> https://tinyurl.com/y4nv6xbp <https://tinyurl.com/y4nv6xbp> <https://tinyurl.com/y4nv6xbp <https://tinyurl.com/y4nv6xbp>>).
>>>>>
>>>>> Benjamin Barrett (he/his/him)
>>>>> Formerly of Seattle, WA
>>>>>
>>>>> On 21 Jan 2021, at 04:54, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM <mailto:wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>>
>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Wikipedia considers the turgid English song, "To Anacreon in Heav'n"
>>>>>> (ca.1770), to be "bawdy":
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "The song, through its bawdy lyrics, gained popularity in London and
>>>>>> elsewhere beyond the Anacreontic Society."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The lyrics irreverently and humorously imagine the enthusiasm of the
>>> gods
>>>>>> to desert Olympus and join the harmonious singers of the Anacreontic
>>>>>> Society, against the wishes of Zeus.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (N.b., a Brit at Quora.com <http://quora.com/> assured followers that the U.S. national
>>>>> anthem
>>>>>> was based on a "pornographic song," but nothing could be less
>>>>> pornographic
>>>>>> than a bunch of drunks trying to sing these lyrics to the same melody
>>> as
>>>>>> the "Star-Spangled Banner.")
>>>>>>
>>>>>> JL
>>
>
------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
More information about the Ads-l
mailing list