[Ads-l] [Non-DoD Source] Re: "man" avoidance

[Dan Goncharoff]

For me, the only similarity between "straw man" and "stalking horse" is
they are old phrases relating to argument and debate that writers today
apparently don't understand bad misuse.

A "straw man" is a generalized creation of an opponent and their views:
"All Democrats are Communists." It can be more detailed than that, but it
tends to exaggerate the views of the other side.

A stalking horse is a real person proposing a controversial view. A
stalking horse can be acting intentionally or seriously be in favor of the
contraversial view. It doesn't matter.

I expect many of the people clamoring for "defund the police" meant it. For
more moderate politicians it was a "stalking horse". When it proved to be
unpopular it was dropped.

I am sure many of the people clamoring for universal health care also meant
it. It was a "stalking horse" for a more moderate expansion of healthcare,
which was popular enough to get passed as the ACA.

On Fri, Jul 22, 2022, 10:54 AM Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu> wrote:

> It's not really used much as a term in argumentation, as far as I know, but
> there is a connection with "straw man/person" arguments. The wikipedia site
> for "stalking horse" gives a good synopsis at
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalking_horse
>
> Note especially the political examples:
>
> =============
>
> The phenomenon occurs particularly in politics, where a junior politician
> acts as the stalking horse to promote the interests of a senior politician,
> who remains unseen in case the actions would damage him or her but
> nevertheless wants to provoke a debate or challenge to a party colleague.
> In some cases, stalking horses are not working for a particular individual
> but may wish to provoke a response that leads others to join in. In
> politics, the truth about the relationship between an individual stalking
> horse and a candidate may never be known, as both sides may claim that the
> (alleged) stalking horse acted without the agreement of anyone else.
>
> For example, in Britain, the elderly and largely unknown back-bench
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backbencher> politician Anthony Meyer
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Anthony_Meyer,_3rd_Baronet> challenged
> and helped to bring about the eventual resignation of Margaret Thatcher
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Thatcher> in the Conservative
> Party
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservative_Party_(UK)> leadership.
>
> In American politics, George W. Romney
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Romney> believed that Nelson
> Rockefeller <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nelson_Rockefeller> had used
> him
> as a stalking horse in the 1968 Republican Party presidential primaries
> <
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Party_presidential_primaries,_1968
> >
>  by promising support, then not providing it and hinting at his own entry
> into the campaign.
>
> =============
>
> I'd venture that the stalking horse has in common with (let's say) the
> straw man is the insincerity and hidden agenda of the perpetrator.
> Different circumstances, but close enough for confusion or conflation to
> arise. (One difference is that someone engaged in misinformation but not
> disinformation can unknowingly present arguments against a straw man, while
> presumably you can't be a stalking horse for someone without knowing that
> you are.)
>
> LH
>
> On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 8:26 AM Amy West <medievalist at w-sts.com> wrote:
>
> > On 6/26/22 00:00, ADS-L automatic digest system wrote:
> > > Date:    Sat, 25 Jun 2022 15:40:10 -0400
> > > From:    Laurence Horn<laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
> > > Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: "man" avoidance
> > >
> > > But in particular (unlike the use of e.g. "a straw person argument"),
> > this
> > > is a likely blend (or confusion) of "straw man" and "stalking horse"
> >
> > Catching up on old e-mail: What's a "stalking horse", esp. in arguments?
> >
> > ---Amy West
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>

------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org