[Ads-l] Antedating "mammoth" (big) - 1801 (was "big cheese" 1815)

Sat Jun 3 23:17:23 UTC 2023

In the 2015 thread, Garson posted an example referring to Thomas Jefferson as the “great Mammoth of Democracy,” from February 10, 1801, https://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/ads-l/2015-January/135764.html.  That is an antedating of “mammoth” as a figurative noun, which the OED takes back only to 1824.  Here is a slightly later example, showing that the figurative noun use was by then taking off:

From the Shop of Comma & Dactyle.

HOWEVER disagreeable it may be, to apply the lash to those loungers we meet on the common road of science, yet is it necessary, and though the creatures may wince, correction is still salutary—Possessing this opinion, we are willing to DEBASE ourselves, by replying to two communications in your last number……………FIRST on the list (great mammoth of literature) appears meek-ey’d CANDOUR, with some “few observations,” deploring the oppression of “injur’d merit.”  This sniveller, after whining a few exclamations, tapers off under the appearance of Candour.

Philadelphia Repository and Weekly Register, at 5, col. 1 (Feb. 21, 1801) (ProQuest American Periodicals).

John Baker

From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> On Behalf Of ADSGarson O'Toole
Sent: Thursday, June 1, 2023 2:27 PM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
Subject: Re: Antedating "mammoth" (big) - 1801 (was "big cheese" 1815)

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Ben Zimmer initiated an interesting thread about the adjective mammoth
back in January 2015.
https://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/ads-l/2015-January/135763.html<https://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/ads-l/2015-January/135763.html>

President Thomas Jefferson was called a "Mammoth of Democracy" and
“(the) Mammoth”.
The phrases "Mammoth Pye", "Mammoth Apple Pye", "Mammoth appetite"
were mentioned on the thread. Ben Zimmer, Geoffrey Steven Nathan, and
I participated in the thread, but I do not remember it.

Garson

On Thu, Jun 1, 2023 at 2:04 PM ADSGarson O'Toole
<adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com<mailto:adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> The OED has a fun citation from Thomas Jefferson for the adjective
> form: "Mammoth-veal" dated October 1801. (After Mammoth Ox.) OED also
> has "Mammoth bread" and "Mammoth Cheese". Mammoth was capitalized.
>
> [Begin OED excerpt]
> mammoth, n. and adj.
> B. adj. Originally U.S.
> Comparable to the mammoth in size; huge, gigantic.
> The reference in quot. 1803 is to a large cheese presented to Jefferson.
>
> 1801 T. Jefferson Let. 22 Oct. in Papers (2008) XXXV. 479 I
> recieved [sic]..a present of a quarter of a Mammoth-veal which at 115.
> days old weighed 438. lb.
> 1802 O. Oldschool in Port Folio 30 Jan. 31/3 A baker in this city
> offers Mammoth bread for sale.
> 1803 J. Davis Trav. U.S.A. ix. 329 Its extraordinary dimensions
> induced some wicked wag of a federalist to call it the Mammoth Cheese.
> [End OED excerpt]
>
> James Eric Lawson wrote:
> > Good early finding, Garson. That researcher's clippings
> > collection suggests an interest in large prehistoric, legendary
> > and fictional creatures (viz clippings about Alley Oop,
> > Godzilla, dinosaurs, etc.) rather than an interest in the
> > particular adjective.
>
> Good point, James. Exploring the adjective was not the primary concern
> of the researcher. He did use the label "First Mammoth adjective" for
> the clipping, so apparently the researcher recognized what he found.
>
> Garson
>
> On Thu, Jun 1, 2023 at 1:50 PM James Eric Lawson <jel at nventure.com<mailto:jel at nventure.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Good early finding, Garson. That researcher's clippings collection
> > suggests an interest in large prehistoric, legendary and fictional
> > creatures (viz clippings about Alley Oop, Godzilla, dinosaurs, etc.)
> > rather than an interest in the particular adjective.
> >
> > On 6/1/23 10:38, ADSGarson O'Toole wrote:
> > > Great work, Peter. Another researcher clipped the same text from a
> > > newspaper published a bit earlier. Thus, investigators are interested
> > > in this adjective.
> > >
> > > Date: May 11, 1801
> > > Newspaper: Hartford Courant
> > > Newspaper Location: Hartford, Connecticut
> > > Quote Page 3
> > >
> > > https://www.newspapers.com/article/hartford-courant-first-mammoth-adjective/29042813/<https://www.newspapers.com/article/hartford-courant-first-mammoth-adjective/29042813>
> > >
> > > [Begin excerpt]
> > > Trenton, April 28.
> > > On Thursday last was brought to this place the famous MAMMOTH OX, bred
> > > by John Humphries of Hopewell, in this county.
> > > [End excerpt]
> > >
> > > Garson
> > >
> > > On Thu, Jun 1, 2023 at 1:12 PM Peter Reitan <pjreitan at hotmail.com<mailto:pjreitan at hotmail.com>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> “Mammoth,” as an adjective referring to something big.
> > >>
> > >> A few months earlier than my last post. Not related to a big cheese.
> > >>
> > >> [Begin excerpt]
> > >> New Jersey. Trenton, April 28. On Thursday last was brought to this place the famous MAMMOTH OX, bred by John Humphries of Hopewell, in this county.
> > >> [End excerpt]
> > >>
> > >> Green Mountain Patriot (Peacham, Vermont), May 28, 1801, page 3.
> > >>
> > >> I was a bit disappointed to find it earlier than the “mammoth cheese” because it seemed to be a more interesting story if the adjective sense of “mammoth” had originated in reference to a “big cheese.”
> > >>
> > >> Mammoths were in the news at the time, because Peale’s museum in Philadelphia had just assembled and displayed a full mammoth skeleton for the first time anywhere.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org<http://www.americandialect.org>
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org<http://www.americandialect.org>
> >
> > --
> > James Eric Lawson
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org<http://www.americandialect.org>

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