[Ads-l] Very Small Antedating of "Dixie"

Fri Jul 25 19:17:19 UTC 2025

To illustrate the ambiguity of Dixie's Land song, it was liked by both Abraham Lincoln and Jefferson Davis.

sg
________________________________
From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Stephen Goranson <0000179d4093b2d6-dmarc-request at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2025 12:24 PM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Very Small Antedating of "Dixie"

Posted before, from January, 1861:

Miss Dix's Land
Sing-Sing

Vanity Fair, New York, v.3, 45/2

https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fbooks.google.com%2Fbooks%3Fid%3DM1I5AQAAMAAJ%26pg%3DPA45%26dq%3Dsing%2B%2522miss%2Bdix%2527s%2Bland%2B%2522%26hl%3Den%26newbks%3D1%26newbks_redir%3D0%26sa%3DX%26ved%3D2ahUKEwirhdb3s9iOAxUSkmoFHdxePK8Q6AF6BAgGEAM%23v%3Donepage%26q%3Dsing%2520%2522miss%2520dix%27s%2520land%2520%2522%26f%3Dfalse&data=05%7C02%7Cgoranson%40DUKE.EDU%7Cb0def861b7dd4cf6f4c808ddcb97bbee%7Ccb72c54e4a314d9eb14a1ea36dfac94c%7C0%7C0%7C638890574748647126%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Pb6Lj%2F2rXX4cvi5KjYWFCx0n9Tt9Vs80ZIG3LkObyR8%3D&reserved=0<https://books.google.com/books?id=M1I5AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA45&dq=sing+%22miss+dix%27s+land+%22&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirhdb3s9iOAxUSkmoFHdxePK8Q6AF6BAgGEAM#v=onepage&q=sing%20%22miss%20dix's%20land%20%22&f=false>

sg
________________________________
From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Stephen Goranson <0000179d4093b2d6-dmarc-request at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2025 9:25 AM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Very Small Antedating of "Dixie"

Dorothea Dix (called, e.g., the Mrs. Elizabeth Fry of the US) was quite famous when the song was composed. As was her effort to establish Dix's Land in Raleigh, NC.

More famous, perhaps, than the game that may have been played in NY.
More so,  in the north, than the New Orleans dix note.
Less so, perhaps, than the Mason Dixon Line, though the Dixon to Dixie to the South multiple transitions proposal may be tenuous. Was then the North Mason-associated?

The original lyrics were what, ironic, illogical nostalgia put in the mouths of free Blacks in the North? Belittled by a blackface minstrel?

Later, later, adapted and adopted or co-opted, in the South as southern pride.

If so, then, originally crazy talk. And where were "crazy people" sent?
To an asylum. Notionally, such as Dix's land. (Easier to sing Dixie.)
Before becoming a contested anthem, given the catchy music, slighting some Blacks and maybe also a do-gooder woman?
Maybe, maybe not.

Stephen Goranson
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From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Stephen Goranson <0000179d4093b2d6-dmarc-request at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2025 2:02 PM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Very Small Antedating of "Dixie"

Though some Dix-plus games were not in the south,
Dix's Land proposal was in the south, Raleigh.
________________________________
From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Jonathan Lighter <00001aad181a2549-dmarc-request at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2025 1:56 PM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Very Small Antedating of "Dixie"

I was niggling pedantically that in principle "Dixie's Land" doesn't
require the existence of a synonymous "Dixie."

But the lyrics are the lyrics. They can't have changed that much between
April 1859 and April 1860 without a complete rewrite, of which there is no
evidence whatsoever.

It's noteworthy (but hardly news) that the correct title of the song is
"Dixie's Land," which in the sheet music is also where the singer will take
his stand, and he wishes he was in "Dixie."

The more euphonious "Dixie land" begins to appear in Newspapers.com in
January, 1861.

None of these terms, when meaning the American South, has been antedated.

JL

On Wed, Jul 23, 2025 at 1:09 PM Stephen Goranson <
0000179d4093b2d6-dmarc-request at listserv.uga.edu> wrote:

> Though we now tend to think and hear Dixieland, even Emmett in 1872
> (as previously posted; his story varied) claimed northern negroes said "I
> wish I was in Dixie's land."
> Much is iffy, but the possessive, dropped in the song, may be worth notice.
>
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of
> Stephen Goranson <0000179d4093b2d6-dmarc-request at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2025 12:00 PM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: Very Small Antedating of "Dixie"
>
> possessive
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of
> Stephen Goranson <0000179d4093b2d6-dmarc-request at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2025 11:27 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: Very Small Antedating of "Dixie"
>
> Dixie's Land—note the plural. 1859
> "Dickies' Land" game 1856
> "those who go to Dixey's land must be Dixey's men" game 1855 [cf .
> sim.1844?]
> And, what I think is under-appreciated:
> Dorothea Dix's Land Bill, for an asylum in North Carolina, multiple times,
> 1854 , and belittled in NY in 1861
>
> Stephen Goranson
> NC
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of
> Jonathan Lighter <00001aad181a2549-dmarc-request at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2025 10:43 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: Very Small Antedating of "Dixie"
>
> Nice, Fred.
>
> There can't be any doubt that the form "Dixie" appeared in Emmett's song
> from the beginning.
>
> The text, however, seems not to have been published till 1860. Possibly the
> earliest published quote from the song to include the word "Dixie"
> [Newspapers.com]:
>
> 1860 _Daily Times-Picayune_ (N.O.) (Apr. 19) 1: To the tune of "I wish I
> was in Dixie."
>
> This may have been posted earlier.
>
> JL
>
> On Wed, Jul 23, 2025 at 9:38 AM Shapiro, Fred <
> 00001ac016895344-dmarc-request at listserv.uga.edu> wrote:
>
> > Barry Popik and Jonathan Lighter have done magnificent etymological
> > research on the word "Dixie," connecting it to the name of a children's
> > game and to the "Mason-Dixon Line."  Here is a tiny (one-day) antedating
> of
> > the OED's entry for "Dixie" meaning the Southern United States:
> >
> > Dixie (OED 1959 [4 Apr.])
> >
> > 1859 New York Herald 3 Apr. 7/5 (Newspapers.com)
> >
> > BRYANT'S MINSTRELS. ... DIXIE'S LAND, another new Plantation Festival.
> >
> > Fred Shapiro
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > The American Dialect Society -
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>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society -
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>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society -
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