[Ads-l] "H-Hour" and "J-Day", 21 Feb 1918

Mon May 5 01:13:49 UTC 2025

Great work Dave, Peter, and Stephen,
Here are some French matches that may be pertinent. It is interesting
that Google Translate maps the combination "le jour J" & "l'heure H"
to "D-day" & "H-Hour".
Garson

Year: 1786:
Title: Le Porte-Feuille Des Enfans : Mélange intéressant d'animaux,
Fruits, Fleurs ...
Table Tile: Temps
https://books.google.com/books?id=BW27vT-S-5gC&q=%22jour+j%22#v=snippet&

[Begin excerpt]
le Jour, J, 24 heures;
l'Heure, H, 60 minutes;
[End excerpt]

Year: 1870
Book: Traité d'arithmétique
https://books.google.com/books?id=4Z3VhpSOVgIC&q=%22l%27heure+%28h%29%22#v=snippet&

[Begin excerpt]
Les unités de temps ne sont pas assujetties à la loi décimale.

L'unité principale est le jour (j). Les unités plus petites sont:
l'heure (h), la minute (m), et la seconde (s) Le jour vaut 24 heures,
l'heure 60 minutes, et la minute 60 secondes.
[End excerpt]

Date: Mars-Avril 1916
Periodical: La Revue de Paris,
Article: LORETTE: UNE BATAILLE DE DOUZE MOIS (Octobre 1914 Octobre 1915)
https://books.google.com/books?id=GbxNAQAAMAAJ&q=%22heure+H%22#v=snippet&

[Begin excerpt]
16 juin. -- Ce matin, on savait que c'était le jour J... Mais nul ne
connaissait l'heure H à laquelle devrait se renouveler le geste
héroïque de la « sortie ». Pendant la nuit, toutes les troupes avaient
gagné leurs emplacements: la même division venait affronter les mêmes
dangers.
[End excerpt]

Date: Janvier-Février 1918
Periodical: La Revue de Paris

[Begin excerpt]
Les dés sont jetés: le jour J, c'est demain matin, 23 octobre, et
l'heure H est 5 h. 15.
Le général M... annonce que l'attaque sera avancée d'un quart d'heure:
5 h. 15, au lieu de 5 h. 30. Mais il fait pleine nuit à 5 h. 15! Il
paraît que cela n'a pas grande importance et que le poilu français
trouvera tout de même le chemin de la victoire.
Le jour J (23 octobre 1917)
[End excerpt]

[Begin Google Translation]
The die is cast: D-Day is tomorrow morning, October 23, and H-Hour is 5:15 a.m.
General M... announces that the attack will be brought forward by a
quarter of an hour: 5:15 a.m., instead of 5:30 a.m. But it's pitch
black at 5:15 a.m.! Apparently, this doesn't matter much and the
French infantrymen will still find the path to victory.
D-Day (October 23, 1917)
[End Google Translation]

Garson

On Sun, May 4, 2025 at 1:26 PM dave at wilton.net <dave at wilton.net> wrote:
>
>
> I had thought of "jump off," but didn't want to bias the suggestions.
>
> But I think "jour" is more likely, and from the emails to the list, somewhat better evidenced. It makes sense that the AEF would have initially adopted French terms (J = jour / H = heure), and then later translated them into English. But the conclusion is speculative.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Peter Reitan" <pjreitan at HOTMAIL.COM>
> Sent: Sunday, May 4, 2025 11:47am
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [ADS-L] "H-Hour" and "J-Day", 21 Feb 1918
>
>
>
> Typo. Le jour J - le jour de l'attaque.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Peter Reitan <pjreitan at HOTMAIL.COM>
> Sent: Sunday, May 4, 2025 7:59:25 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: "H-Hour" and "J-Day", 21 Feb 1918
>
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster: Peter Reitan <pjreitan at HOTMAIL.COM>
> Subject: Re: "H-Hour" and "J-Day", 21 Feb 1918
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> In HathiTrust archive, a 1918 French military publication uses "le hour j -=
>  le jour de l'attaque".
>
> D'un poste de commandement. (P.C. du 21e C.A.) Bataille de l'Ailette (23 oc=
> tobre-2 novembre 1917)
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Peter =
> Reitan <pjreitan at HOTMAIL.COM>
> Sent: Sunday, May 4, 2025 7:41:15 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: "H-Hour" and "J-Day", 21 Feb 1918
>
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -------------------=
> ----
> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster: Peter Reitan <pjreitan at HOTMAIL.COM>
> Subject: Re: "H-Hour" and "J-Day", 21 Feb 1918
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------=
> ----
>
> They are in France, operating and planning alongside French troops, so perh=
> =3D
> aps jour?
>
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of dave at w=
> =3D
> ilton.net <dave at WILTON.NET>
> Sent: Sunday, May 4, 2025 5:55:53 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: "H-Hour" and "J-Day", 21 Feb 1918
>
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -------------------=
> =3D
> ----
> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster: "dave at wilton.net" <dave at WILTON.NET>
> Subject: "H-Hour" and "J-Day", 21 Feb 1918
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------=
> =3D
> ----
>
> =3D3D0AThe OED has 17 September 1918 for "H-Hour," but I've found this from=
>  2=3D
> 1 =3D3D
> February:=3D3D0A =3D3D0AHeadquarters, 16th Infantry. =3D3DE2=3D3D80=3D3D9CP=
> lan for Ra=3D
> id on Rich=3D3D
> ecourt Salient.=3D3DE2=3D3D80=3D3D9D 21 February 1918. World War Records Fi=
> rst Di=3D
> vision=3D3D
>  A.E.F. Regular, vol. 10. First Division Museum. [ https://firstdivisionmus=
> =3D
> =3D3D
> eum.nmtvault.com/jsp/PsImageViewer.jsp?doc_id=3D3D3Dcdf20c52-01e6-47b0-ba0b=
> -6=3D
> 57=3D3D
> 4c9e5437f%2Fiwfd0000%2F20180808%2F00000002 ]( https://firstdivisionmuseum.n=
> =3D
> =3D3D
> mtvault.com/jsp/PsImageViewer.jsp?doc_id=3D3D3Dcdf20c52-01e6-47b0-ba0b-6574=
> c9=3D
> e5=3D3D
> 437f%2Fiwfd0000%2F20180808%2F00000002 )[ ]( https://firstdivisionmuseum.nm=
> =3D
> =3D3D
> tvault.com/jsp/PsImageViewer.jsp?doc_id=3D3D3Dcdf20c52-01e6-47b0-ba0b-6574c=
> 9e=3D
> 54=3D3D
> 37f%2Fiwfd0000%2F20180808%2F00000002 )=3D3D0A =3D3D0A"Artillery: From J min=
> us 5=3D
>  day=3D3D
>  to J day=3D3DE2=3D3D80=3D3D94Cutting gaps in the enemy=3D3DE2=3D3D80=3D3D9=
> 9s wire at p=3D
> oints other =3D3D
> than that of the real objective, namely, Salient LAHAYVILLE and Salient 252=
> =3D
> =3D3D
> 0.=3D3D0A=3D3D0A"[=3D3DE2=3D3D80=3D3DA6]=3D3D0A =3D3D0A"Box Barrage=3D3DE2=
> =3D3D80=3D3D94A box b=3D
> arrage of 45 minutes=3D3D
>  duration will be held at H hour as shown on the sketch. At H plus 25 the b=
> =3D
> =3D3D
> ox barrage will close down to the enemy=3D3DE2=3D3D80=3D3D99s first four li=
> nes wh=3D
> ich wi=3D3D
> ll be heavily shelled till close of operation."=3D3D0A =3D3D0AI have no ide=
> a wh=3D
> at t=3D3D
> he "J" stands for. Any info or guesses are welcome.=3D3D0A =3D3D0AI was una=
> ble =3D
> to a=3D3D
> ntedate the OED's 7 September use of "D-Day." I think that the term may hav=
> =3D
> =3D3D
> e been introduced for this operation. (I found one relating to the same ope=
> =3D
> =3D3D
> ration in a field order of a subordinate unit dated 10 September.)
>
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>
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