[Ads-l] Karen out, Jessica in

Fri Feb 6 22:11:19 UTC 2026

I would have written  "Though ONLY the name has changed, the way she
expresses her entitlement has evolved...."
DanG

On Fri, Feb 6, 2026 at 3:26 PM Charles C Rice <charles.rice at louisiana.edu>
wrote:

> I also thought it was a strange though, so I went to COCA and searched
>
> though the * HAVE changed
>
> 28 hits, with 26 unique nouns — lots of different things are represented,
> from language and fundamentals to plot and leaders.
> Only one token did not meet the structural requirements, using "it's
> almost as though the company has changed" with no indication of something
> else remaining the same.
> 12 hits with 'even though'
>
> The clause indicating no change is marked with
> 6 tokens of 'same'
> 6 tokens of 'remain' (both those counts include 3 tokens of 'remain the
> same')
> 5 tokens of 'still'
> 2 tokens of 'continue'
> 1 token each of 'indistinguishable', 'very' ("in this very room"), 'not'
> (with 'changed' elided),
>
> So the construction looks something like this:
> (even) though NP1 HAVE changed, NP2 remain the same
> with NP1 and NP2 related in some pragmatic frame
>
> A typical example is " Though the leaders have changed repeatedly, the
> results have remained the same. "
>
> The adversative 'though' paired with 'change' introduces a binary
> implicature to the effect that some related thing has or does not change.
> The order of clauses does not affect the implicature; 8 tokens have the
> 'remain' clause first, like
> "He’d  had countless  identical  meals  at  this very  table  as  a  boy,
> and  it  was mockery  —
> the props remaining exactly the same though the plot had changed so
> utterly."
>
> 5 tokens with no direct lexical marking of "remain the same." Lexical
> realization of the implicature through 'stll', 'remain', or the like is not
> required, so in a sentence like
> "It felt very natural, even though the technology has changed", we are to
> understand that the speaker perceives enough similarities to feel "natural"
> despite the changes.
> Another example: "Even though the world has changed, we can't have unisex
> bathrooms in middle school."
>
> In Jon's example, "Though the name has changed, the way she expresses her
> entitlement has evolved...." I think the writer has leveraged the
> implicature in a particularly obscure way. Though NAME changed, ENTITLEMENT
> has not changed, and EXPRESSION of entitlement has also changed.
>
> Clai Rice
>
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of
> David Bowie <db.list at PMPKN.NET>
> Sent: Friday, February 6, 2026 12:15 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: Karen out, Jessica in
>
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>
> Huh, interesting. For me, it still counts as a contrast being introduced
> by /though/, because one is the name, and the other is the
> entitlement—therefore, it's a contrast in the sense that it's talking
> about two /different things/ that are in some particular way related.
>
> Now i'm curious what the distribution is of what counts as a contrast in
> this particular sort of thing.
>
> David
>
>
> On 2/5/2026 8:00 PM, Jesse Sheidlower wrote:
> > I'm with Jon here; this immediately hit me as being off.
> >
> > _though_ should introduce some kind of contrast: "Though X has changed,
> Y is the same." Here, the name has changed, "but" the way she acts
> has...also changed.
> >
> > The article is arguing that Karens and Jessicas are similar; but this
> sentence goes in a different direction.
> >
> > Jesse Sheidlower
> >
> > On Wed, Feb 04, 2026 at 08:29:10PM -0900, David Bowie wrote:
> >> Okay, I'll bite: What's weird about the use of 'though' here? It feels
> >> bog-standard normal to me.
> >>
> >> David
> >>
> >>
> >> On 2/4/2026 8:00 PM, ADS-L automatic digest system wrote:
> >>> Date:    Wed, 4 Feb 2026 09:22:50 -0500
> >>> From:    Jonathan Lighter<wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> >>> Subject: Karen out, Jessica in
> >>>
> >>>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.yahoo.com%2Fcreators%2Flifestyle%2Fstory%2Fgen-z-says-karen-is-out--and-a-new-name-for-rude-entitled-women-is-going-viral-152958311.html&data=05%7C02%7Ccharles.rice%40LOUISIANA.EDU%7C1325c6e390c34c589f4b08de6547348e%7C13b3b0cecd7549a4bfea0a03b01ff1ab%7C1%7C0%7C639059553839431670%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C80000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=lbJqQo4FhvIN5yFSCgwFOWiTefVnrIc98Ql3JK2zGKk%3D&reserved=0
> <
> https://www.yahoo.com/creators/lifestyle/story/gen-z-says-karen-is-out--and-a-new-name-for-rude-entitled-women-is-going-viral-152958311.html
> >
> >>>    :
> >>>
> >>> While the stereotype of the “Karen” is fading, the behaviour it
> represents
> >>> is still very much alive, just under a new name: “Jessica.” Though the
> name
> >>> has changed, the way she expresses her entitlement has evolved....
> >>>
> >>> The “Jessica” persona is much quieter and operates mainly online.
> Instead
> >>> of causing a ruckus in a store, she prefers to address her grievances
> from
> >>> behind a computer screen, where she has more control.
> >>>
> >>> (Note weird use of "though.")
> >>>
> >>> J.
> >>> -- "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
> >>> truth."
>
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