logic error: Gapt [gothic-l]

[keth at ONLINE.NO]

Hi Dirk,
you wrote:
>Hello Keth,
>
>I don't know much about the linguistic details around Gaut, (Geat,
>Gaus) and Gapt, but I thought this dychotomy Gaut and Gapt was
>intended to reflect other dychotomic gods like Raus and Rapt of the
>Vandals etc.? I think that the whole idea of gods in pairs goes back
>to classical mediteranean beliefs and should not be over interpreted
>in the specific case.
>
>cheers,
>Dirk

Yes, that was one of the arguments I was intending to use, in addition
to the others.

I am not familiar with your example of "Raus" and "Rapt",
but if those two names refer to a pair of Vandal gods, and you look
at the letter structure, it evidently forms a mirror image of the name-pair
under discussion, "Gaut" (or Gauss) versus "Gapt".


What I had in mind, is the legend of the mythical "brothers"
who become the progenitors of neighboring tribes. Often such
brothers have similar sounding names that frequently commence
on the same letter.

You mention classical mediterranean ideas, and indeed, one can here
easily quote the example of the Bible, where the 3 sons of
Noah become the progenitors of all subsequent humanity
(in this case the post-diluvian humanity); they are Sem, Cham and
Japhet. Often two brothers have very similar names (Sem and Cham),
whereas the third one has a slightly different name (Japhet = Jafet).

In Tacitus it is mentioned that Mannus was the father of Ing, Ist
and Ermin. Here evidently Mannus is the analogue of Noah, and the
2 brothers with similar names are Ing and Ist, while the third
brother whose name is slightly different, is Ermin.

Also in Roman legend Romulus and Remus.

Hengist and Horsa of the Saxons is another example in the same vein.

I am sure more examples can be found. Your example Raus/Rapt
is the best one yet, and needs to be investigated.

Finally, I'd also like to point out that the Icelandic legend,
that we have been using as basis for much of the discussion, and that
Jacob Grimm also used to establish his axiom Gapt=Gaut,
does not operate with only one progenitor either, but does in fact
also have several, as it is attested by Snorri in his important
source book "Gylfaginning".

In Snorri, then, you will see that he too follows the pattern
that is familiar from mediterranean legend, to have several
progenitors whose names all begin on the same  letter.
i.e. in Snorri: "Gaut", "Gylfi", "Gefjon".

In this connection it is also highly interesting to look at the
etymologic significance of these names:


Gaut = (perhaps) connected to the verb "gjóta" = to pour;
       connection with river name?

Gylfi = connection with 'gylfr' = river name?
        may also be related to "gjalfr" = noise, ocean,
        high waves (Finnur Jónsson).

Gefjon = > finn. kapiot = bridal gift.
         Westgermanic Latin Gabiae = 'the giving ones'
         or 'the very rich'. Jan de Vries thinks the best
         possibility is to relate the name to "gefa".


But isn't this name "Gefjon" then actually quite similar
to "Gapt" interpreted in its relationship to 'gift' ?


Best regards
Keth








You are a member of the Gothic-L list.  To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe at egroups.com>. 

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/