[gothic-l] Re: Tracing the Eruli

[george knysh]

--- ?????? ???????? <vegorov at ipiran.ru> wrote:
>  ^^^V.E.: Let's keep in mind that this incorporation
>
> is still highly hypothetic. Even Jordanes did not
> affirm
> any incorporation having confined himself with a
> Hermanaric's
> final victory upon Heruli.

*****GK: Cf GETICA (XXIII):"...non passus est nisi et
gentem Herulorum, quibus praeerat Halaricus, magna ex
parte trucidatam reliquam suae subegeret dicioni."

 SUAE SUBEGERET DICIONI certainly intimates more than
just a military victory. It is the language of
political incorporation.*****

 BTW, I doubt this final
> victory.
> In particular, how could Hermanaricus subdue
> nautical Heruli
> (see my next insertion below)? > ^^^V.E.: Perhaps
locating initial Heruli at the Don
> mouth is disputable, but those Heruli with enigmatic
> borani attacked the Roman settlements at Caucasian
> shores of the Black sea in the middle of the 3rd c.
> using Bospor ships. Hence, Heruli were among the
> tribes (my former hypothetic exploring "wild
> Germanic tribes"?) having conquered the Bospor
> Kingdom. (George had already objected to the term
> "conquest" in respect of Bospor and Gerrmanic
> tribes. Accepting this objection, I'm ready to
> replace this arguable term by "seizure" or
> "invasion".) Anyhow, Heruli WERE in the middle of
> the 3rd century not only at Maeotis Swamps, but even
> behind them in East Crimea and Taman peninsula. Of
> course, explanation of who were those "borani" would
> clarify the whole situation.

*****GK: Of course I agree with the proposition that
the Eruli and others "were" there in the mid- 3rd c.
They also "were" on the southern coast of the Black
Sea, on the Argean sea, in Greece, but this does not
mean that their settlements "were there" only that
raiding parties penetrated "there", leaving behind
evidence of their temporary presence. And by the
second half of the 4th c. neither the Eruli nor the
Goths seem to be all that "nautical".******


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