[gothic-l] Re: Gothic in Balkan

[faltin2001]

--- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "Francisc Czobor" <fericzobor at y...>
wrote:
> Hi, Dirk,
>
> I quoted the information about Gothic speakers from an old book of
> mine ("Introduction to the Comparative Grammar of the Germanic
> Languages", University of Bucharest, 1971) where no further
> indication (regarding which work of W. Strabo) is given. According
to
> the same book, "In central Europe Gothic may have lingered somewhat
> longer in view of the Salzburg manuscript (10th century)...




Hi Francisc,

I think the Salzburg manuscripts only refer to Gepids (Gepidae), but
they don't mention Goths or Gothic if I am not mistaken. It is
probably assumed that these Gepids spoke Gothic at this time, but it
is probably not certain.





Possibly
> the information there given was derived from southern Hungary or
> Transylvania where remains of the Gepidae were to be found shortly
> before the Magyars [Hungarians] settled in these regions (AD 889)."



This is likely the information provided by the Bavarian missionary
documents, which mention Gepids.




> Thus it seems that we have here two distinct situations of survival
> of Gothic until the 9th/10th century in Central&Eastern Europe:
> 1. Gepids in Pannonia and/or Transylvania;



This seems probable, if the term Gepids refered to the actual
situation and was not some sort of historicism, which is also
encountered in medieval documents which wronly speak of Heruls,
Wandals and other in east Germany and Poland. However, I suspect that
the term was still in use as it is mentioned also in the context of
the battle of Poirtiers when Alamanni and Gepids formed one army unit
of the Franks.





> 2. Gothi Minores (Lesser Goths) in Moesia.



The Gepids must have been pagans I suppose, since the Bavarians tried
to convert them, while these Gothi Minores were of course Christians.
The use of Gothic as liturgical language since the time of Wulfila
would, I think, help the longer term survival of Gothic in these
regions.






> And, of course, we have the survival of Gothic in Crimea (not very
> far from the Lesser Goths) until the 18th century.
>




Of course some remnants of Crimean Gothic are recorded in the 16th
century. Whether it was still spoken in the 18th century is uncertain
I think. A.A. Vasiliev wrote that Busbecq's informants' describtion
of Mangub as a lively settlement was cast into doubt by another
contemporary report stating that the place is all but deserted with
only a few old monks still living their. I suspect that Crimean
Gothic died out in the course of the 17th century. Certainly, in the
18th century Christians were deported from Crimea, who in Vasiliev's
words 'may have had a drop of Gothic blood in their veins', yet their
language is described as Turkic I think.

Cheers
Dirk








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