Vedr. RE: [gothic-l] Re: Gothic influence on Spanish language?

Sun Mar 18 20:53:04 UTC 2007

Hello,
I have joined the group recently. I am from the Czech Republic, and in the southeast of the country there is a little mountain range called Pálava...I dont know its etymology though. Czech cognate to Proto-Slavic *pelva is pleva, meaning chaff or glume.

David Simecek

"Paperno D." <denis.paperno at avicomp.com> skrev:                                  Hails Michel Sauvant,

 No idea about the Spanish word, just a little remark about its putative
 Slavic origin.

 Proto-Slavic *pelva 'straw' gives South Slavic plEva and East Slavic polova.
 Note that /o/ in Old Slavic languages is a short vowel, as opposed to long
 /a/ (phonological pattern opposite to the Germanic one), and thus could well
 be adapted as *palavo>palava in Gothic.

 This phonological correspondence is quite plausible, unlike the rest of the
 story.

 1)       The further Spanish adaptation looks quite aukward;

 2)       This version would presuppose (Visi)Gothic contacts with East
 Slavs, which is not impossible, though their later contacts with South Slavs
 are much better attested (please correct me, I don't feel free in such
 historical questions)

 3)       The early Germanic-Slavic linguistic contacts (for that epoch, it's
 hard to distinguish whether they were particularly Gothic-Slavic) are
 attested mostly in borrowings INTO Slavic, not from Slavic (please correct
 me if I oversimplify in this point).

 4)       The early Germanic-Slavic linguistic contacts usually connected
 with the name of Goths are dated at the Proto-Slavic epoch, and East-Slavic
 to Gothic looks like anachronism.

 Best,

 Denis Paperno

 _____  

 From: gothic-l at yahoogroups.com [mailto:gothic-l at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
 Of michelsauvant
 Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 5:30 PM
 To: gothic-l at yahoogroups.com
 Subject: [gothic-l] Re: Gothic influence on Spanish language?

 Hello,
 Unfortunatly,I don't have this book and...
 I have a question regarding the word for "straw" in Spanish (balago). 
 I looked on dictionnaries and I arrived at the following choice: 

 1- Greacian words "pallo" or "paluno" introduced by Phoceans in 
 theirs colonies (Nice, Antibes, Cannes, Marseille, Emporion) and 
 becommind in Gallo-Roman Age the verb "ballo, ballare".
 >From participial form "ballatum" the Wisigoths could have 
 made "balago".

 2-Wisigoths imported to Spain a word "palava(?)" coming from one 
 language on the sides of Black Sea where they lived during a long 
 time. (references Sanskrit "palaavah" = "straw" and modern 
 russian "palevyj" = "straw" and other slavic languages)
 The word "palava (?)" could have been mutated in "balago" when 
 wisigoths arrived in South of France and in Spain.

 In South of France we had medieval terms "balagaire" 
 meaning "sweeper". But I think that the first "sweeping" for 
 a "balagaire" was, during wisigotic age, for separating grain from 
 straw with a kind of broom. I found a village named Villa Balagari at 
 the end of Wisigothic age.

 Does anyone know if balago was introduced into the Spanish language 
 by the Goths ? 
 Or does anyone know if palava (?) could have been used around year 
 350 by Goths when they were near Black Sea?

 Michel SAUVANT

 --- In gothic-l at yahoogroup <mailto:gothic-l%40yahoogroups.com> s.com, Carl
 Edlund Anderson <cea at ...> wrote:
 >
 > Just as an added note, there is a short passage summarizing Gothic 
 > lexical influence on Spanish (within a section of a few pages on 
 > early Germanic borrowings generally) in Ralph Penny's _A History 
 of 
 > the Spanish Language_.
 > 
 > Cheers,
 > Carl
 > 
 > --
 > Carl Edlund Anderson
 > http://www.carlaz. <http://www.carlaz.com/> com/
 >

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