Reduplication Histling-l Digest, Vol 25, Issue 7

Wed Feb 11 23:12:30 UTC 2009

It isn't hard to come up with examples of languages that have lost reduplication, but wasn't the original question concerned with languages _developing new_ reduplicating systems?

The tense-aspect reduplications of Latin, Gothic, Greek etc. are surely of Indo-European date, and so don't count as examples of newly developed reduplication, the theme of the question. Nor do isolated examples like English 'ping-pong', German 'beben'. Perhaps someone can give us examples of creoles that have developed (re)duplication?

I seem to remember somewhere someone making a distinction between (partial) _reduplication_ like Latin tetigi, Indonesian sesuatu "some or other" and (whole) _duplication_ like Indonesian barang-barang "different kinds of things" (barang='thing'), orang-orang 'people'. There are many subtypes, and a biiiig literature.

Paul Hopper
---------

> Latin conjugations:  tango~tetegi; many Latin and Greek nouns and
> adjectives
> 
> âáñâáñoò being the best known; some Koine Greek verbs
> 
> 
> 
> Scott Catledge
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message----- From: histling-l-bounces at mailman.rice.edu 
> [mailto:histling-l-bounces at mailman.rice.edu] On Behalf Of 
> histling-l-request at mailman.rice.edu Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009
> 1:01 PM To: histling-l at mailman.rice.edu Subject: Histling-l Digest, Vol 25,
> Issue 7
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> Today's Topics:
> 
> 
> 
> 1. development of reduplication systems (John Kyle)
> 
> 2. Re: development of reduplication systems (Paolo Ramat)
> 
> 3.  development of reduplication systems (Jeff Roesler Stebbins)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
> 
> Message: 1
> 
> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 12:17:51 -0600
> 
> From: John Kyle <jhobartkyle at gmail.com>
> 
> Subject: [Histling-l] development of reduplication systems
> 
> To: Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
> 
> Message-ID:
> 
> <5290124a0902101017x3a77fecau8f9d642ee270de88 at mail.gmail.com>
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> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
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> 
> 
> I was wondering if anyone had any examples of languages which have
> developed
> 
> a reduplication system when the parent language didn't have a
> reduplication
> 
> system.  I've seen examples of languages which have lost reduplication
> (and
> 
> of course languages which have retained a reduplication system) but I
> have
> 
> not been able to find any examples of a reduplication system which
> developed
> 
> on its own.  If anyone could let me know of any references or examples, I
> 
> 
> would gladly post a follow-up with the information.  Thank you.
> 
> 
> 
> John Kyle
> 
> jhobartkyle at gmail.com
> 
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> ------------------------------
> 
> 
> 
> Message: 2
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:05:30 +0100
> 
> From: "Paolo Ramat" <paoram at unipv.it>
> 
> Subject: Re: [Histling-l] development of reduplication systems
> 
> To: "John Kyle" <jhobartkyle at gmail.com>,  <Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu>
> 
> Message-ID: <EE0767A046EA4D0793BB42FB8BA149CF at acerpaolo>
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> 
> 
> Dear John,
> 
> what exactly do you mean by "reduplication system"? I'm aware of many 
> languages having reduplication in their paradigms (e.g. the perfect tense
> in Classical Greek --
> 
> which later went lost in Byzantine and Modern Greek). But can we consider
>  Greek as a reduplication system language?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prof. Paolo Ramat
> 
> Istituto Universitario di Studi Superiori (IUSS)
> 
> Responsabile della classe di Scienze Umane
> 
> V.le Lungo Ticino Sforza 56, 27100 Pavia ? Italia
> 
> Tel. +39 0382 375811 Fax +39 0382 375899
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From: John Kyle
> 
> To: Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 7:17 PM
> 
> Subject: [Histling-l] development of reduplication systems
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was wondering if anyone had any examples of languages which have 
> developed a reduplication system when the parent language didn't have a 
> reduplication system.  I've seen examples of languages which have lost 
> reduplication (and of course languages which have retained a
> reduplication system) but I have not been able to find any examples of a
> reduplication system which developed on its own.  If anyone could let me
> know of any references or examples, I would gladly post a follow-up with
> the information.  Thank you.
> 
> 
> 
> John Kyle
> 
> jhobartkyle at gmail.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> --- --
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Histling-l mailing list
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> Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
> 
> https://mailman.rice.edu/mailman/listinfo/histling-l
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> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> 
> 
> Message: 3
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:22:53 -0700 (MST)
> 
> From: Jeff Roesler Stebbins <Jeff.Stebbins at Colorado.EDU>
> 
> Subject: [Histling-l]  development of reduplication systems
> 
> To: Paolo Ramat <paoram at unipv.it>, John Kyle <jhobartkyle at gmail.com>,
> 
> Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
> 
> Message-ID: <20090211072253.AKH37075 at superman.int.colorado.edu>
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> 
> 
> Go to Google Scholar and type "Vietnamese reduplication"--you'll see a
> lot about
> 
> reduplication in VNese and several related languages.  We Westerners
> might be prone to
> 
> focus upon the consonants, but (as you can read in some of those papers) 
> VN's
> 
> reduplication system also interacts a lot with its tonal system, which
> has developed (and
> 
> is still developing) independently of neighboring Sino-Tibetan and
> Tai-Kadai tonal
> 
> languages.
> 
> Jeff Stebbins
> 
> Univ. Colorado, Linguistics
> 
> 719-660-6280
> 
> - - - -
> 
> 
> 
> "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep
> 
> to gain what he cannot lose." (Elliot)
> 
> 
> 
> ---- Original message ----
> 
> 
> 
> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:05:30 +0100
> 
> From: "Paolo Ramat" <paoram at unipv.it>
> 
> Subject: Re: [Histling-l] development of reduplication systems
> 
> To: "John Kyle" <jhobartkyle at gmail.com>,<Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu>
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> Dear John,
> 
> what exactly do you mean by "reduplication system"?
> 
> I'm aware of many languages having reduplication in their paradigms (e.g.
>  the
> 
> perfect tense in Classical Greek --
> 
> which later went lost in Byzantine and Modern
> 
> Greek). But can we consider Greek as a reduplication system
> 
> language?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prof. Paolo Ramat
> 
> Istituto Universitario di Studi Superiori
> 
> (IUSS)
> 
> Responsabile della classe di Scienze Umane
> 
> V.le Lungo Ticino Sforza
> 
> 56, 27100 Pavia ? Italia
> 
> Tel. +39 0382 375811 Fax +39 0382 375899
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> From:
> 
> John
> 
> Kyle
> 
> To: Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 7:17
> 
> PM
> 
> Subject: [Histling-l] development of
> 
> reduplication systems
> 
> I was wondering if anyone had any examples of languages which have
> 
> developed a reduplication system when the parent language didn't have a
> 
> reduplication system.  I've seen examples of languages which have lost
> 
> reduplication (and of course languages which have retained a reduplication
> 
> 
> system) but I have not been able to find any examples of a reduplication
> 
> system which developed on its own.  If anyone could let me know of any
> 
> references or examples, I would gladly post a follow-up with the
> 
> information.  Thank you.
> 
> 
> 
> John Kyle
> 
> jhobartkyle at gmail.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> --- ----------
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Histling-l mailing
> 
> list
> 
> Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
> 
> https://mailman.rice.edu/mailman/listinfo/histling-l
> 
> 
> 
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-- 
Prof. Dr. Paul J. Hopper
Senior Fellow
Freiburg Institute for Advanced Studies
Albert-Ludwigs-Universität Freiburg
Albertstr. 19
D-79104 Freiburg
and
Paul Mellon Distinguished Professor of Humanities
Department of English
Carnegie Mellon University
Pittsburgh, PA 15213

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