Borrowed word order in phrases

[Paul Hopper]

The following examples are from Henri Bauche's book Le langage populaire.
Grammaire, syntaxe et dictionnaire du français tel qu’on le parle
dans le peuple de Paris, avec tous les termes d’argot usuel. Paris: Payot,
1928.

les femmes qu’il a couché avec “the women he’s slept with”
je lui ai couru après “I ran after him”
tu n’as pas travaillé pour "You didn't work for it"

A few years ago Geoff Nathan (perhaps on HistLing) reported a waiter as
saying "J'y suis pour", presumably "that's what I'm here for".

Bauche comments that these forms are often attributed to a Germanic
substratum, but says they are also found in Italian. True?

Paul






> Hi Eduardo,
>
> An example of a stranded preposition in French [but no idea of where the
> writer is from]:
>
> www.leforum.bistrophilo.fr/.../viewtopic.php?f...t...
> Mar 3, 2009 - 10 posts - 6 authors
> Mmmm c'est délicieux ; on la mettait de côté et à la fin de la semaine il
> y
> en avait assez *pour faire une tarte avec* !
>
> Cheers,
>
> Peter Hook
>
>
>
> On Sun, Dec 15, 2013 at 5:59 AM, Koka <lachicadelgorro at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dear Eduardo,
>>
>> A recent account of the word order "Nada sé" (as opposed to "No sé
>> nada")
>> in Spanish by Octavio de Toledo attributes this word order to Latin
>> influence. You can check the paper (in Spanish) out here (
>> https://www.academia.edu/2552836/Entre_gramaticalizacion_estructura_informativa_y_tradiciones_discursivas_algo_mas_sobre_nada_).
>>
>>
>> Hope it helps!
>>
>> Carlota
>>
>> > Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2013 01:09:15 -0500
>> > From: kariri at gmail.com
>> > To: etnolinguistica at yahoogrupos.com.br; histling-l at mailman.rice.edu;
>> LINGTYP at listserv.linguistlist.org
>> > Subject: [Histling-l] Borrowed word order in phrases
>>
>> >
>> > [apologies for cross-posting]
>> >
>> > Dear colleagues,
>> >
>> > I'm looking for examples of languages where certain (types of) phrases
>> > present a different, borrowed word order when compared to a more
>> > common, inherited type. Well-known examples are, in English, legal
>> > terms in which the adjective follows the noun, preserving the original
>> > Norman French order: "attorney general", "court martial", etc.
>> > (Jespersen 1912:87-88).
>> >
>> > Are you aware of similar examples from other languages? And of cases
>> > in which the borrowed order, originally limited to borrowed lexemes,
>> > ended up becoming the default usage?
>> >
>> > I would appreciate any insights and bibliographic references on this
>> topic.
>> >
>> > Obrigado,
>> >
>> > Eduardo
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Eduardo Rivail Ribeiro, lingüista
>> > http://etnolinguistica.org/perfil:9
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Histling-l mailing list
>> > Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
>> > https://mailman.rice.edu/mailman/listinfo/histling-l
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Histling-l mailing list
>> Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
>> https://mailman.rice.edu/mailman/listinfo/histling-l
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Histling-l mailing list
> Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
> https://mailman.rice.edu/mailman/listinfo/histling-l
>


-- 
Paul J. Hopper,
Paul Mellon Distinguished Professor of Humanities Emeritus,
Department of English,
Dietrich College of Humanities and Social Sciences,
Carnegie Mellon University,
Pittsburgh, PA 15213,

Adjunct Professor of Linguistics,
University of Pittsburgh

Senior External Fellow,
School of Linguistics and Literature,
Freiburg Institute for Advanced Studies (FRIAS),
Freiburg i.Br., Germany

Publications: <http://carnegie-mellon.academia.edu/PaulHopper>
              <http://scholar.google.com/citations?hl=en&user=n2e7ANUAAAAJ


_______________________________________________
Histling-l mailing list
Histling-l at mailman.rice.edu
https://mailman.rice.edu/mailman/listinfo/histling-l