Nelson update on Idiom comprehension in child language

Fri Jun 6 14:38:32 UTC 2014

One interesting observation that I've heard is that people who are (late)
L2 learners will have problems in using and understanding idioms in the
non-native language.  This appears to be true in speakers who have perfect
phonology and grammar and might be otherwise indistinguishable from native
speakers.  It suggests that the acquisition of idioms is somehow linked to
mechanisms that differentiate between L1 and L2 processing.

Peter Gordon

On Fri, Jun 6, 2014 at 9:34 AM, Keith Nelson <k1n at psu.edu> wrote:

> HI all.    Here is the specific reference on the the intervention study
> (also discussed in  the JSLHR research paper) with ASD children for
> idioms.   Best regards,  Keith N
>
>
> *Whyte, E. M., Nelson, K. E, & Khan, K. S. (2013). Learning of idiomatic
> language expressions                          in a group intervention for
> children with autism, Autism, 17, 449-464.*
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Keith Nelson <k1n at psu.edu>
> Date: Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 11:44 AM
> Subject: Re: Idiom comprehension in child language
> To: info-childes at googlegroups.com, Keith Nelson <keithnelsonart at gmail.com>
>
>
> Hi all.   I m attaching a JSLHR  paper just out from our lab that reviews
> lit and presents an intervention study on idiom comprehension.   Cheers,
> Keith
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 9:44 AM, Tom Roeper <roeper at linguist.umass.edu>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi folks--
>>
>> just to mention a couple of things--an example I just heard:
>>      "I know a shortcut"
>>      "well, I know a shorter cut"
>> and cases like "you're a slowpoke, but I'm a fastpoke".
>>
>> I wrote a paper on idioms with Zvi Penner that appears
>> in the volume for Jüregen Weisenborn by Mouton--it
>> relates to complex sentences.
>>
>>   Work by Ellen Winner on Metaphor seems pertinent
>> to children's comprehension of them.  A child with
>> a stomache who said"
>>        "there's a fireengine in my stomach"
>> or a child with a stuffed nose who said:
>>         "there's paint in my nose".
>>
>> Deviations from compositionality can still be logically
>> motivated.
>>
>> Tom Roeper
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 5:09 AM, Mehmet ÖZCAN <mehozcan20 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Hüseyin,
>>>
>>> (I answer all of the questions you posed me personally here thinking
>>> that other colleagues might want to comment on them as well)
>>>
>>> ·         (Concerning your question about the location of data
>>> collection) The location you are going to collect the data depends
>>> totally on the location of the study carried out by Gokmen and her student
>>> (as you mentioned) to find out the words determined as “prototype words”;
>>> watermelon which is found to be 8th item on the list in Ankara may be
>>> the first or third in Urfa or Adana; or orange the first in Mediterranean
>>> Region, if you are going to construct your  sentences depending on their
>>> list. In a nutshell, prototypicality is idiosyncratic and a common sense of
>>> prototypicality occurs when the personal senses of prototypicalities
>>> overlap to the sufficient extent.
>>>
>>> ·         One problem with the hypothesis: As far as I understood, you
>>> assume that idiomatic expressions are processed within the framework of
>>> compositionality theory: the meaning of a phrase or a larger linguistic
>>> unit can be grasped by knowing the meaning/function of each element the
>>> whole unit contains. This may be the case in most cases, especially when it
>>> comes to accessing the literal meaning. As you know, Compositionality
>>> Theory has been criticized for not being able to explain the processing of
>>> pragmatics in the expressions. Thus, you may revise your assumptions.
>>>
>>> ·         Another thing to concentrate on may be the prototypicality of
>>> the idiomatic expression (among other idiomatic expressions) itself rather
>>> than the expressions’ containing prototypical elements. You know, *some
>>> birds are birder than other birds*. Some idiomatic expressions may have
>>> some prototypical features structurally or regarding other qualities.
>>>
>>> ·         Integrating infant directed speech to this study would be too
>>> much to my understanding. You will have to carry out longitudinal
>>> observations to measure the exposition of a child to idiomatic expressions
>>> or the words in the list determined by the previous studies.
>>>
>>> I am looking forward to hearing about the findings of your demanding
>>> study. Good luck in all ways.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, May 20, 2014 12:56:54 AM UTC+3, huy... at gmail.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Dear all,
>>>>
>>>> First of all, I would like to express my excitement about posting my
>>>> first question in this group (Of course, after reading the older posts).
>>>>
>>>> I have been reading about Prototype Theory of Eleanor Rosch, which is
>>>> the point of departure for my M.A thesis, within the frame of child
>>>> language development. Then I suddenly found myself trying to design steps
>>>> for (an) experiment(s) in idiom comprehension. I am partly aware of the
>>>> literature in figurative language processing (thanks to the comprehensive
>>>> chapter by Gibbs and Colston in http://www.sciencedirect.com/
>>>> science/book/9780123693747). So my questions are as follows:
>>>>
>>>>    - What is the direction of research in idiom comprehension in child
>>>>    language?
>>>>    - Could you suggest me some seminal works in idiom comprehension,
>>>>    or more generally figurative language?
>>>>    - Is there anyone to help me revise my experimental design?
>>>>    - What kind of an effect could prototypicality of concepts in
>>>>    idioms have on children's comprehension? (Feel free to share your criticism
>>>>    or advice, if you prefer to look at this research question from another
>>>>    perspective.)
>>>>    - A third research field having just popped into my mind is child
>>>>    directed speech. In what way can I integrate it into my research?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Huseyin
>>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Tom Roeper
>> Dept of Lingiustics
>> UMass South College
>> Amherst, Mass. 01003 ISA
>> 413 256 0390
>>
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-- 
Peter Gordon, Associate Professor
Biobehavioral Sciences Department, Box 180
Teachers College, Columbia University
1152 Thorndike Hall
525 W120th St.
New York, NY 10027
Phone: 212 678-8162
Fax:     212 678-8233
E-mail: pgordon at tc.edu
Web Page:http://www.tc.columbia.edu/faculty/index.htm?facid=pg328

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