Fw: [Lexicog] semantic domains AND frames?

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Translation MALI" <translation_mali at sil.org>
To: <lexicographylist at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 05, 2004 11:02 AM
Subject: RE: [Lexicog] semantic domains AND frames?


> From Fritz (+ 40 C. temperature) to Wayne (-32 C.)
>
> > (Wayne)
> > Isn't it possible for semantic domains used for lexical entries to be
> > defined by indigenous semantic taxonomies?
> > (Fritz)
> > That would be easier in a monolingual semantic domains dictionary.
> > In your example below I see that you would have a cross-cultural problem
> > with classification in a bilingual dictionary.
>
> I don't understand the problem, Fritz. Please explain.
>
> (Fritz)
> Wayne, I assumed that you plan to do a bilingual SEMANTIC DOMAIN
dictionary,
> as you started out your question "Isn't it possible for semantic domains
> ..."
> Maybe my assumption was wrong.
> But, if so, then which kind? If it were something like Louw/Nida's
> "Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament based on Semantic Domains",
> then I would have as the first question how these domains were
established.
> My guess is that componential analysis (CA) was used, but CA is
questionable
> as a heuristic device.
> In a monolingual semantic domains dictionary one can use indigenous
> semantic taxonomies which are more likely to reflect emic semantic fields.
>
> Or maybe, your dictionary follows a traditional approach to lexicographic
> description using a headword as central to the organization of the
> dictionary and listing the different senses associated with the headword
> in a lexical entry. For each of the individual senses associated with
> the headword, in such a traditional dictionary information is listed
> about its meaning, its usage, register, etc.
> Information about usage and synonyms are pointers to semantic fields.
> (but such a dictionary does not qualify as a "semantic domains
dictionary").
>
> I just don't know what kind of dictionary you are working on.
>
> Sooner or later we will have to define our terms on this list
> (like "semantic domains", etc.)
>
>
> > (Wayne)
> > For instance, in Cheyenne we can say Ehovaheve 'He is an animal,' using
an
> > indigenous superordinate semantic category. Then when we come to the
name
> of
> > some animate being, we can ask Ehovahevehe? 'Is he an animal?" Well, if
I
> > ask that of voaxaa'e 'bald eagle,' I will get the answer "Hova'hane,
> > eve'keseheve" ('No, he is a bird.'; reflecting another indigenous
semantic
> > category). If I ask of the word hetane 'man', "Ehovahevehe?", I will get
> the
> > Cheyenne answer, "Hova'hane, evo'estaneheve," ('No, he is a person,'
> > reflecting the Cheyenne vo'estane 'person' superordinate semantic
category
> > and not the "scientific" Western-oriented category of "animal" where, at
> > least for some English-speaking individuals, a "man" is an animal--of
> > course, some men are!!
> > (Fritz)
> > I know you use inclusive language, so you must mean "man" = male here.
>
> Yes, I do in English. And Cheyennes would never use their word for 'man'
for
> anything other than a male adult.
>
> > How would you say in Cheyenne "she ate like an animal"?
>
> Hmm, I have no idea. First of all, Cheyennes don't have a way to
> differentiate "he" from she" (of course, they can do so periphrastically
by
> referring to a male or female person). Cheyenne only has third person, no
> (male/female) gender marked in the pronominal affixes on the verbs, nor in
> the separate "pronouns" which are only used for in marked contexts.
>
> So, how to say that someone "ate like an animal"? I'm not clear on what
that
> means in English, but if it means to eat voraciously or noisily, I suppose
> one of the following might get us into the proverbial ballpark:
>
> Ehao'pohe. He/She is gluttonous.
> Eko'konosane. He/She noisily chewed.
>
> (Fritz)
> In German we have a different verb for someone who "eats like an animal."
> For a person with good table manners we would use the verb "essen", for
> the glutton "fressen". So the difference between human and animal behavior
> is indicated by the verb. We can say "to eat like a pig" which is very
> negative, but "to pig out" does not seem to be the equivalent in English.
>
> Wayne
> -----
> Wayne Leman
> Busby, Montana, U.S.A.
> Cheyenne dictionary project:
> http://www.geocities.com/cheyenne_language/cddicy.htm
>
>
>
>
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