[Lexicog] Law of Synonyms

Wed Oct 15 22:45:43 UTC 2008

Scott, as you want one single answer, I have to make a decision: In none of
the two. 

(I'm willing to debate it off-list).

In a couple of hours (1 a.m. here in West Africa) I'll watch the 3rd
presidential debate in the US.

So I say good night as far as the discussion goes,

Fritz

Fritz, do Germans believe in the power of the American dollar, or in German
synonyms? I want one single answer.
Scott
--- On Wed, 10/15/08, Fritz Goerling <Fritz_Goerling at sil.org> wrote:

From: Fritz Goerling <Fritz_Goerling at sil.org>
Subject: RE: [Lexicog] Law of Synonyms
To: lexicographylist at yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 6:03 PM

Scott,

When it comes to connotation of so-called "synonyms" we seem to agree in
theory that there are none. But then you mention I lost my cool. || I could
wring his neck. || Emotions are running high. || The room is at a boiling
point. || If he even looks at me cross-eyed.. . || It galls me! || She's
really hot under the collar. || He went ballistic. || He's fit to be tied.
|| She went through the roof as synonyms of being "angry." Do they not all
differ in connotation? One would find such lists in Roget's Thesaurus. I
would call them "synonyms" only in a very wide sense because all would be
used in different contexts.

As a Bible translation consultant I am interested in precision and to  help
our translators find the best equivalent of source language words in their
respective receptor language. If Greek or Hebrew have different words like
surprised, amazed, astounded, shocked, dumbfounded, thunderstruck, startled,
caught unawares, flabbergasted, taken aback, stunned, awestruck, which to me
express fine nuances, I help them to exploit their language to find at least
some equivalences; sometimes they have even more words in a semantic domain
than the source languages. 

A tool which I recommend to Bible translators is:

Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament based on Semantic Domains

Author: Louw, <http://www.logos.com/search/Louw%2c+Johannes+P.>  Johannes
P.; Nida, Eugene A. <http://www.logos.com/search/Nida%2c+Eugene+A.> 
Publisher: United Bible Societies
Publication Date: 1996
<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/external-search/103-9654184-6443061?tag=l
ogosreseasystei&index=books&keyword=Greek-English%20Lexicon%20of%20the%20New
%20Testament%20based%20on%20Semantic%20Domains> 
Read more about print editions 

Price

DOWNLOAD

$39.95 

Add to Cart 

Payments <http://www.logos.com/ebooks/details/LOUWNIDA##>  starting at just 

 <http://www.logos.com/ebooks/details/LOUWNIDA##> 

 <http://www.logos.com/ebooks/details/LOUWNIDA##> $21.32 

 <http://www.logos.com/ebooks/details/LOUWNIDA##> 

 <http://www.logos.com/ebooks/details/LOUWNIDA##>   Click for details... 

Libronix DLS 3.0e Required! 

This downloadable book requires Libronix Digital Library System 3.0e or
greater. Click the Add to Cart button to see options for updating your
system if you're running an older version. 

Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament based on Semantic Domains

Louw-Nida Greek Lexicon is a modern Greek lexicon using the concept of
"semantic domains." This lexicon differs from other lexicons in that it does
not arrange words alphabetically and it does not give one listing of a word
with all of that word's meanings after it. Instead, it breaks words down by
their various shades of meaning. It then groups all of those entries
together and organizes them by topics and sub-topics. It shows the nuances
in word meanings and explains difficult expressions and idiomatic usages of
words, and even provides advice on how words might be translated under
various conditions. Since it groups words by meanings, it shows distinctions
in meaning between similar words, and also between differences in one word's
meaning in different contexts, as well as showing the overlaps between word
meanings.

Maybe you have something like that in mind?

Best,

Fritz Goerling

Fritz, I've considered your observation of the impossibility of there being
a true "synonym," too. This is why I'm disappointed in standard dictionaries
lacking listings of connotation, frequency, and context -- which could quite
easily be identified in digital format. As to the general concept of
synonyms, though, I think there are true synonyms -- which are exhibited in
divergent phrasing, not necessarily in divergent meaning or connotation. 
Notice the different grammatical form -- including tense, person, and mood
-- in the following phrases, which all mean essentially "angry." -- I lost
my cool. || I could wring his neck. || Emotions are running high. || The
room is at a boiling point. || If he even looks at me cross-eyed.. . || It
galls me! || She's really hot under the collar. || He went ballistic. ||
He's fit to be tied. || She went through the roof. 
By the way, Fritz, did you hear about the German truck that was loaded with
thesauruses yesterday? It crashed into a dictionary publishing company
building. The bystanders were surprised, amazed, astounded, shocked,
dumbfounded, thunderstruck, startled, caught unawares, flabbergasted, taken
aback, stunned, awestruck, caught with heir pants down, ... 
It must be a human aversion to cliche that makes humanity come up with
synonyms. Maybe the answer is in that simple principle.

Fritz, do Germans have synonyms?

Scott Nelson

--- On Wed, 10/15/08, Fritz Goerling <Fritz_Goerling@ sil.org> wrote:

From: Fritz Goerling <Fritz_Goerling@ sil.org>
Subject: RE: [Lexicog] Law of Synonyms
To: lexicographylist@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 12:45 PM

Is there a law of synonyms? I don't believe in synonyms. No two words are
exactly "synonymous" from the point of view of connotation.

Concerning your example from the computer domain, let me mention another
example, given to me by a computer specialist. Who speaks of 'jump drive' or
'pen drive' any more? It's probably between 'flash drive' and 'thumb drive'
nowadays. And who knows what will come up next.

When two or more expressions come up at about the same time and compete,
'brevity (punch)' is one factor IMO that makes the winner.

Brevity is the soul of wit (Shakespeare, Hamlet 2, 86-92), 

Fritz Goerling 

Law of Synonyms 
There must be a law of synonyms somewhere (of phrasal synomyms 
in particular). Dictionaries and thesauruses (thesauri) seem too 
arbitrary & random too trust for this purpose. Of course, corpora 
listings are easy for words. I've been wondering for years what the 
world would gravitate toward -- "laptop" or "notebook" 
computer. "Portable computer" seems quaint, but... The reason I'm 
fishing in this pond is that I would hate wading through 
dissertations or theses looking for synonym principles (must be lazy 
or something). The only simple, quick source for finding phrasal 
frequency comparisons seems to be google-counting. "Laptop" (computer
(s)) wins on this one, generally by 22%-30%. But we're dealing with 
the `phrase' "notebook computer" and "laptop computer." 
Googling "notebook" alone skews the results. 
Has anyone done, or seen, research about how one term (or 
phrase) tends to predominate over others -- when two or more 
expressions begin at about the same time? Is is there a phonetic 
(e.g. reduplicative, length, ease-of-pronunciati on) influence? Is 
there a "great-man" influence, according to coiner? First come, first 
served? Regional? Or is it truly unpredicable? 
This is an open-ended question.... Any ideas?

Scott Nelson

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lexicography/attachments/20081015/d55c1216/attachment.htm>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image007.gif
Type: image/gif
Size: 55 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lexicography/attachments/20081015/d55c1216/attachment.gif>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image006.gif
Type: image/gif
Size: 55 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lexicography/attachments/20081015/d55c1216/attachment-0001.gif>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image005.jpg
Type: image/jpeg
Size: 3382 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lexicography/attachments/20081015/d55c1216/attachment.jpg>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image004.gif
Type: image/gif
Size: 55 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lexicography/attachments/20081015/d55c1216/attachment-0002.gif>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image003.gif
Type: image/gif
Size: 54 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lexicography/attachments/20081015/d55c1216/attachment-0003.gif>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image002.gif
Type: image/gif
Size: 137 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lexicography/attachments/20081015/d55c1216/attachment-0004.gif>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: image001.gif
Type: image/gif
Size: 433 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/lexicography/attachments/20081015/d55c1216/attachment-0005.gif>