attitudes of the Ladin-speaking population in South Tyrol

Fri Jan 9 03:32:46 UTC 2004

I agree with Christina Paulston that the attitudes of the Ladin-speaking population in South Tyrol are crucial. 

A Ladin language use survey was published in 1995. 

The study shows that Ladin is possible and used in most daily situations in the family and the community. Over 90% of respondents regarded themselves as Ladin. Local, i.e., Ladin forms of government are seen as having a positive orientation toward Ladin; in contrast, the regional, i.e, provincial government is regarded as being less interested in Ladin.

The respondents' attitudes 
"demonstrate the uncertainty about the extent to which a minority language that is highly prestigious on a local level bears relevance outside of the area, that is whether status corresponds to prestige. Yet there is an evident feeling that the language should be extended in administrative use but the specific probe concerning such a use in public service . does not emanate such a positive response. The general orientation towards Ladin is positive few feeling that it is under threat while feeling that it is an essential ingredient of being Ladin, and that children should be socialised by reference to the language. In no way is it seen as a marker of low social status. However there is a higher degree of uncertainty when Ladin is related to modernity and science."

The study is available online at: http://www.uoc.edu/euromosaic/web/document/ladi/an/e1/e1.html

Alkistis Fleischer

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Christina Paulston" <paulston+ at pitt.edu>
To: <lgpolicy-list at ccat.sas.upenn.edu>; <lgpolicy-list at ccat.sas.upenn.edu>
Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 7:57 PM
Subject: Re: printability and standardization

> I wrote a long response to this spate of comments, apparently caused by a 
> not very well put comment by me on labels not including Ladin.  And as I was
> about to send it, I was cut off the net. No patience to repeat my comments
> but briefly:
>     1 Anyone who has read Elizabethan literature knows print and
> standardization is not the same.
>     2. I was not talking about LCTL, oral traditions, etc but only about
> Ladin.
>     3. It has been the preference of the Ladin speaking population not to
> use written Ladin in their bilingual schooling because of the many different
> dialects and they did not want any friction. Who are academics to tell them
> what they should want?
>     4. Before we condemn the policies, maybe one should ask the Ladin
> speaking population what they think?
>     5. The literature on bilingual education (eg Brown's dissertation on LA
> French-English) is full of examples of the negative effect on dialect
> attitudes by putting a written, standardized version of the dialect into the
> classroom (to normal people, not linguists) - that was my intended
> reference.
> But I expect that no one contributing to this discussion really knows what
> the reaction is of the Ladin speaking population itself. I respectfully
> submit we should find out before we go on any further. Christina Paulston
> 
> ----------
> >From: Joshua Fishman <joshuaafishman at yahoo.com>
> >To: lgpolicy-list at ccat.sas.upenn.edu
> >Subject: Re: printability and standardization
> >Date: Wed, Jan 7, 2004, 3:09 PM
> >
> 
> > And of course, there is standardization in
> > non-literate (oral) cultures! JAF
> >
> > --- "Harold F. Schiffman"
> > <haroldfs at ccat.sas.upenn.edu> wrote:
> >> Thank you, Joshua, for reminding us that
> >> standardization and print are separate issues.
> > I have tried to make that case for 'standard'
> > Spoken Tamil, which doesn't often appear in
> > print, since literary Tamil (with extreme
> > diglossic differences) serves that purpose.
> > People who work in western linguistic traditions
> > tend to think that print equals standardization,
> > and nothing else matters.
> >> Sanskrit developed a method of
> >> controlling 'standard' without resorting to
> >> print, and other languages can
> >> do the same.
> >>
> >> My article on this is ``Standardization and
> >> Restandardization: the case of
> >> Spoken Tamil." Language in Society, Vol. 27 (3)
> >> 359-385. (1998)  and it's
> >> also available on my website at
> >>
> > http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/~haroldfs/public/stantam/STANTAM.HTM
> >>
> >> Hal Schiffman
> >>
> >> On Tue, 6 Jan 2004, Joshua Fishman wrote:
> >>
> >> > The discussion of (non-)Standardization of
> >> Ladin
> >> > and the "reluctance" of the Italian
> >> government to
> >> > utilize it in print should remind us that
> >> print
> >> > and standardization are quite separate and
> >> > independent of each other. Many languages
> >> have
> >> > been printed (and, of course, also written)
> >> far
> >> > before their standardization and, indeed,
> >> their
> >> > use in print contributed greatly to their
> >> > ultimate standardization (viz. D-B Kerler
> >> 2003).
> >> > Of course, standardization did not rescue
> >> Latin,
> >> > Greek, Hebrew, etc. from disappearing as
> >> > vernaculars. It would be particularly
> >> > "indelicate" for the Italian government to
> >> snub
> >> > Ladin due to Ladin's lack of full
> >> > standardization, given the lack of full
> >> > standardization of Italian to this very day.
> >> > English too is far from being fully
> >> standardized,
> >> > which should lead most of us to be rather
> >> less
> >> > dismissive of Ladin for this same very human
> >> > "failing". All in all, "complete
> >> standardization"
> >> > is a will-of-the-whisp and some small
> >> languages
> >> > are far closer to this goal (acting on the
> >> > mistaken assumption that it will promote
> >> their
> >> > acceptance) than much larger ones who
> >> couldn't
> >> > care less. Joshua A. Fishman
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > =====
> >> >
> >>
> > ____________________________________________________________
> >> > HOME: 3616 Henry Hudson Pkwy., Apt. 7B-N,
> >> Bronx NY 10463
> >> > home tel: 718-796-8484; home fax:
> >> 718-796-8155 (3 page limit); OFFICE tel:
> >> 718-430-3850; office fax: 719-430-3060.
> >> >
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> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
> > =====
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > HOME: 3616 Henry Hudson Pkwy., Apt. 7B-N, Bronx NY 10463
> > home tel: 718-796-8484; home fax: 718-796-8155 (3 page limit); OFFICE tel:
> > 718-430-3850; office fax: 719-430-3060.
> >
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> > 
> 
>
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