AW: word order of cardinals

[bingfu Lu]

Dear Thomas,
  Sorry, there is two typos in my previous posting:
  The title of the posting should be ¡°word order of ordinals¡±, not ¡°cardinals¡±.
   
  We want to know the possible counterexample and relevant literature and data in other languages.
  In addition, in some languages, ordinals morphologically belong to adjectives, such as Russian.  
   
  In Russian, ordinals are more adjective-like than cardinals in the sense that all ordinals are morphologically adjective but not all cardinals.  What we really want to know is that is there any other languages than Slavic where ordinals are more adjective-like than cardinals.
   
  Thanks for your information of the literature, which is most important and helpful to our  investigation!
   
  What you said about the particularity of number ¡®one¡¯ (even if ordinals precede the noun, the cardinal ONE may follow the noun) is totally consistent with our data. Many languages in China behaves like Maltese in this aspect.  Renping may tell you which languages.  
   
  Best
  Bingfu 


Thomas Stolz <stolz at UNI-BREMEN.DE> wrote:        v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}        st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }                Dear colleagues,
   
  at the university of Bremen, we are currently conducting a large-scale crosslinguistic study of the grammar of ordinal numerals. We also look at word-order issues and word-class membership problems of numerals. First of all, cardinal numerals behave like adjectives in loads of languages ¨C especially Indo-European ones. However, this is often true only of a certain sub-set of the cardinals (lower cardinals as opposed to higher ones, digits as opposed to decimal values, etc.). Thus, there is a difference between Latvian and Lithuanian on the one hand and Greek on the other: Latvian and Lithuanian treat most of their numerals as adjectives when it comes to agreement while Greek has agreement only for numerals including the digits 1, 3 and 4. Details can be found in the work by Hurford, Veselinova and my own. For the latter see:
   
  Stolz, Thomas. 2001. d?„Ordinalia ¨C Linguistisches Neuland. Ein Typologenblick auf die Beziehung zwischen Kardinalia und Ordinalia und die Sonderstellung von EINS und ERSTER.¡°, in Was ich noch sagen wollte¡­ A multilingual Festschrift for Norbert Boretzky on occasion of his 65th birthday, herausgegeben von Birgit Igla & Thomas Stolz (= Studia Typologica 2). Berlin: Akademie-Verlag, 507-530. 
   
  Stolz, Thomas. 2002. „Is ‚one¡® still ‚one¡® in ‚tewnty-one¡®? On agreement and government properties of cardinal numerals in the languages of Europe.¡°, Sprachtypologie und Universalienforschung 55, 354-402. 
   
  STOLZ, Thomas & VESELINOVA, Ljuba. 2005.
                     „Ordinal numerals.¡°, in: The World Atlas of Language Structures, edited by Martin Haspelmath, Matthew S. Dryer, David Gil & Bernard Comrie. Oxford: Oxford University Press, 218-221.
   
   
  Please note that there are also interesting problems on the micro-level: even if ordinals precede the noun, the cardinal ONE may follow the noun (this is the case in Maltese, for instance). 
   
  Good luck with the project and keep me informed
   
  Thomas Stolz
   
   
  Prof. Dr. Thomas Stolz
  Universität Bremen
  FB 10: Linguistik
  PF 330 440
  D-28 334 Bremen/Germany
   
   
   
      
---------------------------------
  
  Von: Discussion List for ALT [mailto:LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG] Im Auftrag von bingfu Lu
Gesendet: Samstag, 18. August 2007 17:16
An: LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
Betreff: word order of cardinals

   
    Dear colleagues,

    One colleague of mine is investigating the word order of ordinal numerals. Based on her database of 112 languages in China, she got the following implicational universal: If ordinal numeral precedes the head noun, cardinal numerals does as well. Her data as shown below:

    Ord-N & Card-N 53

    N-Ord & N-Card 52

    N-Ord & Card-N 15

    N-Ord & N-Card 0

    (some languages has two order, therefore, the total numbers of languages above is larger than 112).?We want to know the possible counterexample and relevant literature and data in other languages.

    In addition, in some languages, cardinals morphologically belongs to adjectives, such as Russian.?We also need to know other languages where cardinals morphologically as adjectives.

     

    Replies to this inquiry can be send to my colleague Renping Jiang (renpingjiang at 126.com) and me.

    If correspondents is enough, we will make a summary.

     

    Bingfu Lu

    Institute of Linguistics



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