Possession/modification by simple juxtaposition

Tue Dec 2 10:15:24 UTC 2008

Dear all,

I didn’t bring up Sirionó (another Tupí-Guaraní language) here before
because it wouldn’t seem to differ from the description of Guaraní below. In
Sirionó the relational r- is still operative in active verb paradigms but
has fossilized elsewhere. So synchronically something like ari rasi ‘a sick
old woman’ and mbia rerekua ‘the people’s chief’ look like simple
juxtaposition. But that is not the whole story, since when the word for
‘chief’ is used without a lexical possessor, it would tend to carry a prefix
which is either a pronominal possessive marker or a dummy prefix e-, that
is, ‘the chief’ would be ererekua. So one possible analysis is that it is
rather the absence of this prefix than juxtaposition as such that signals
the possessive construction. Which, I guess, shows that it all depends on
your point of view, or, if you like, juxtaposition is in the eye of the
beholder.

Östen

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From: Discussion List for ALT [mailto:LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG] On
Behalf Of Francoise Rose
Sent: den 2 december 2008 10:29
To: LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
Subject: Possession/modification by simple juxtaposition

Dear all,

Well in fact I would’nt want to commit myself in analyzing Guarani
synchronically. But at least diachronically Tupi-Guarani languages do
generally use the order P[ossess]um/P[ossess]or = Noun/Attribute, in some
cases without any special marker. But a relational “r-“ is required on some
head nouns (the head being the element to the right even in the
noun-attribute’ structure where the attribute is considered a noun or a verb
depending on the author). So “rasy” can at least diachronically be segmented
as “r-asy”. Moreover, the Possessum is originally marked with an –a suffix
when consonant-final, which is never the case in the examples below, if I
remember well because Guarani lost its final consonants. If that is the case
and let alone the question of the r- prefix, this would show how a marked
gentive structure could evolve into a simple juxtaposition.

Best,

Françoise ROSE

Françoise ROSE

Dynamique Du Langage (CNRS, Université Lumière Lyon 2)

Institut des Sciences de l'Homme

14 avenue Berthelot

69363 Lyon Cedex 07

FRANCE

(33) 4 72 72 64 63

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De : Discussion List for ALT [mailto:LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG] De
la part de Wolfgang Schulze
Envoyé : samedi 22 novembre 2008 13:18
À : LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
Objet : Re: Possession/modification by simple juxtaposition

Wouldn't it make sense to refer to Guaraní in order to illustrate
P[ossess]um/P[ossess]or = Noun/Attribute strategies marked for
juxtaposition? Taking the data from Maura Velazquez' article "Guarani
possessive constructions"
(http://crl.ucsd.edu/newsletter/3-6/Article1.html), the Guarani strategy can
be illustrated as follows:

Por-Pum:

Maria mesa
Maria table
'Marias table'

Maria ajaka
Maria basket
'Maria's basket'

Noun-Attribute:

py'a rasy
stomach sick
'sick stomach' ~ 'stomach ache'

resa rovy
eye blue
'blue eye(s)'

As for Por/Pum, Velazquez writes: "When the PSR [= Por, W.S.] is a lexical
noun (...),  nominal  possession is regularly indicated by a simple
juxtaposition of the two nominals  involved:  N1 (PSR)  N2  (PSM) [= Pum,,
W.S.].  There is no special morpheme marking the PSR or the PSM.  The
designated  (i.e.,  profiled) element is the PSM."

Personally, I wonder whether the rigid pre-modifying strategy, namely
Por-Pum / Attr-N is documented with juxtaposition at all. In WALS, David Gil
mentions the "Västerbotten dialect of Swedish, in which alienable possessors
and colour properties may both be expressed by means of a compound
construction in which the modifier precedes the head":

Pelle-äpple
Pelle-apple
'Pelle's apple'

rö-äpple
red-apple
'red apple'

But do we have languages in which both juxtaposition and pre-modification
occur as a general (!) pattern, or is the post-modifying Pum-Por - N-Attr
correlation (with yuxtaposition) a more general option, competing with the
heterogeneous Por-Pum / N-Attr strategy (again with yuxtaposition)?
Summarizing some of the data given in this thread, we might state for
yuxtaposition:

                 Attr-N                 N-Attr
Por-Pum     e.g. Swedish       e.g. Guaraní       
Pum-Por     e.g. Welsh          ?  

[Both Swedish and Welsh 'partial']

Best wishes,
Wolfgang

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