[Lingtyp] Verbal person-number indexing reconstructed for a family/deeper subfamily?
gil at shh.mpg.de
Wed Jun 20 16:18:28 UTC 2018
In my previous posting, my use of the term "person agreement" was
imprecise, as I think Martin is implying: in the Austronesian cases that
I am familiar with, the "conominal" (to use Martin's term from his
"Argument Indexing" paper) is indeed optional, not obligatory as in
German and English.
On 20/06/2018 13:38, Martin Haspelmath wrote:
> Changing the topic a bit: I'm glad that the term "person(-number)
> indexing" is being used in this discussion, because "agreement in
> person" seems to be extremely rare in the world's languages (found
> only in Germanic, Romance, and Anejom, according to Siewierska 1999: 239).
> Many linguists use the term "agreement" in situations like Spanish "yo
> quier-o“, even though in almost all languages with person indexes the
> independent personal pronoun is only used to emphasize the referent.
> This seems to be motivated primarily by the situation in German and
> English, where the pronoun is indeed obligtory and the verb can be
> said to copy its person-number features from the pronoun.
> Or am I missing something? Are there other reasons to use the term
> "person agreement", e.g. in the Austronesian languages of eastern
> Indonesia that David mentions?
> Siewierska, Anna. 1999. From anaphoric pronoun to grammatical
> agreement marker: Why objects don’t make it. /Folia Linguistica/
> 33(1–2). 225–252.
> On 20.06.18 09:36, David Gil wrote:
>> This is not exactly what you're asking for, but perhaps close enough
>> to be of interest. Austronesian languages typically do not have
>> verbal person-number subject indexes; however, in many Austronesian
>> languages of eastern Indonesia, verbal agreement has arisen, and, for
>> the most part, the markers in question are clearly reconstructable to
>> the earlier Austronesian independent pronouns.
>> On 19/06/2018 21:52, Ilja Seržant wrote:
>>> Dear all,
>>> I am looking for families (or subfamilies with a larger time depth)
>>> for which verbal person-number subject indexes / "agreement" affixes
>>> (featuring the intransitive subject for ergative lgs.) are
>>> reconstructed. (I already have data on Dravidian, Semitic,
>>> Indo-European, Maya, Finno-Ugric and Turkic but I need more for my
>>> study on the dynamics of these).
>>> I would be very grateful for any reference.
> Martin Haspelmath (haspelmath at shh.mpg.de)
> Max Planck Institute for the Science of Human History
> Kahlaische Strasse 10
> D-07745 Jena
> Leipzig University
> IPF 141199
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> D-04109 Leipzig
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Department of Linguistic and Cultural Evolution
Max Planck Institute for the Science of Human History
Kahlaische Strasse 10, 07745 Jena, Germany
Email: gil at shh.mpg.de
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