[Lingtyp] Verbal person-number indexing reconstructed for a family/deeper subfamily?

[David Gil]

In my previous posting, my use of the term "person agreement" was 
imprecise, as I think Martin is implying: in the Austronesian cases that 
I am familiar with, the "conominal" (to use Martin's term from his 
"Argument Indexing" paper) is indeed optional, not obligatory as in 
German and English.


On 20/06/2018 13:38, Martin Haspelmath wrote:
> Changing the topic a bit: I'm glad that the term "person(-number) 
> indexing" is being used in this discussion, because "agreement in 
> person" seems to be extremely rare in the world's languages (found 
> only in Germanic, Romance, and Anejom, according to Siewierska 1999: 239).
>
> Many linguists use the term "agreement" in situations like Spanish "yo 
> quier-o“, even though in almost all languages with person indexes the 
> independent personal pronoun is only used to emphasize the referent. 
> This seems to be motivated primarily by the situation in German and 
> English, where the pronoun is indeed obligtory and the verb can be 
> said to copy its person-number features from the pronoun.
>
> Or am I missing something? Are there other reasons to use the term 
> "person agreement", e.g. in the Austronesian languages of eastern 
> Indonesia that David mentions?
>
> Best,
> Martin
>
> *********
>
> Reference
>
> Siewierska, Anna. 1999. From anaphoric pronoun to grammatical 
> agreement marker: Why objects don’t make it. /Folia Linguistica/ 
> 33(1–2). 225–252.
>
>
> On 20.06.18 09:36, David Gil wrote:
>> Ilja,
>>
>> This is not exactly what you're asking for, but perhaps close enough 
>> to be of interest.  Austronesian languages typically do not have 
>> verbal person-number subject indexes; however, in many Austronesian 
>> languages of eastern Indonesia, verbal agreement has arisen, and, for 
>> the most part, the markers in question are clearly reconstructable to 
>> the earlier Austronesian independent pronouns.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> David
>>
>>
>> On 19/06/2018 21:52, Ilja Seržant wrote:
>>> Dear all,
>>>
>>> I am looking for families (or subfamilies with a larger time depth) 
>>> for which verbal person-number subject indexes / "agreement" affixes 
>>> (featuring the intransitive subject for ergative lgs.) are 
>>> reconstructed. (I already have data on Dravidian, Semitic, 
>>> Indo-European, Maya, Finno-Ugric and Turkic but I need more for my 
>>> study on the dynamics of these).
>>>
>>> I would be very grateful for any reference.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Ilja
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Martin Haspelmath (haspelmath at shh.mpg.de)
> Max Planck Institute for the Science of Human History
> Kahlaische Strasse 10	
> D-07745 Jena
> &
> Leipzig University
> IPF 141199
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>
>
>
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>
>
>
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-- 
David Gil

Department of Linguistic and Cultural Evolution
Max Planck Institute for the Science of Human History
Kahlaische Strasse 10, 07745 Jena, Germany

Email: gil at shh.mpg.de
Office Phone (Germany): +49-3641686834
Mobile Phone (Indonesia): +62-81281162816

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