LL-L "Folklore" 2001.12.06 (01) [E/LS]

Lowlands-L sassisch at yahoo.com
Thu Dec 6 16:20:51 UTC 2001 

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 06.DEC.2001 (01) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: Thomas <t.mcrae at uq.net.au>
Subject: LL-L "Folklore" 2001.12.05 (03) [E]

on 6/12/01 6:43, Lowlands-L at sassisch at yahoo.com wrote:

> About the "maere/mare" etc. In West-Flemish (Belgium) there is a saying
> when people announce to somebody, that somebody is going to announce him or
> her a bad message, that they will "do him the "mare"
When camping in Holland in the early 50's we young Scots were surprised to
learn that a request for more was 'maer' e.g. 'maer broet' which came close
to our Scots 'maer breid'.
Regards
Tom
Tom Mc Rae PSOC
Brisbane Australia
"The masonnis suld mak housis stark and rude,
To keep the pepill frome the stormes strang,
And he that fals, the craft it gois all wrang."

>From 15th century Scots Poem 'The Buke of the Chess'

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From: "Mathieu. van Woerkom" <Mathieu.vanWoerkom at student.kun.nl>
Subject: folklore

Ron wrote:

> In German, _Mahr_ alone may be used in the sense of 'nightmare', as
> apparently may Danish _mare_, Norwegian _mare_ and Swedish _mara_.
> According to the _Herkunftsduden_, these words (< _mara_) go back to
> the name for an Old Germanic female ghoul.  Non-Germanic cognates are
> found in Celtic and Slavic; e.g., Old Irish _mor-(r)ígain_ 'female
> ghoul or vampire', Russian _mora_ as in _kikí-mora_ 'nocturnally
> haunting ghoul'.

In Limburgisch, we also know the word _maar_, which can mean "witch", but
also "female ghost" and especially "nightmare". I guess this word goes back to
the same Old Germanic roots as mentioned above.

Cheers,
Mathieu

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From: "Selma Schepel" <selmaschepel at hetnet.nl>
Subject: LL-L "Folklore" 2001.12.05 (01) [E]

Reinhard/Ron:
>Old Irish _mor-(r)ígain_ 'female ghoul or vampire'...
Has the name of King Arthurs nasty sister Morgan anything to do with this?

Sandy:
>These personifications of the nightmare appear in English
>literature as the "Succubus" (female) and "Incubus" (male)...
Incubus and Succubus are types of ghost that must have been known worldwide.
Ancient Sumerian literature already speaks of 'Lulilla' and 'Munuslilla',
the Babylonians of Lilu and Lilitu, ghosts who were jealous of normal,
happy, young people, and drove men and women sexually mad at night, even
could kill them. The well known mythical Hebrew Lilith is a Babylonian
inheritance.
With kind regards,
Selma Schepel

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From: "Dawn Work" <dawn_work at uswest.net>
Subject: Folklore

This is my favorite time of year on Lowlands-L, and I can usually be
counted on to come out of lurk mode. This is the time of year when the Wild
Lady of winter makes her appearance on the list! Since I monitor the list
for hints of women's stories and folklore, this always makes me happy.

First, a request. Would someone be willing to give the "gist" in English of
"De Helderbut" kindly posted by Berend Klonne, the text by Grietje Clewits?

Second, a comment. I have been keeping my eyes open in the last half-year
for stories of "White Ladies" or "The White Lady." I have seen hints of her
in a wide range of European folklore, and, interestingly, I ran into her in
Missouri. There are some lovely German settlement communities between Des
Moines and St. Louis, in the "Missouri Wine Country." A little bit of the
Rhine come to the New World. There is a small Catholic parish in between
several tiny towns that features shrines to the "White Lady of
Starkenburg." There is even a white wine of the same name. It is evidently
a pilgrimage site even in modern times. I expect these settlers to have
come more from Southern Germany, with their Catholic background. I have
researched some stories about the White Lady of Starkenburg, who is of
course assumed to be the Virgin Mary in this Catholic context, but I am
curious as to whether a folkloric figure could have been merged with the
Churchly Mary in this particular case. I hope to return to the Starkenburg
area, and perhaps to attend one of the pilgrimage weekends, in search of
more stories.

I enjoy Lowlands-L year-round, and feel fortunate to be able to observe
such a fascinating community of scholars. I am currently in the application
process for a PhD in Religious Studies from the Union Institute,
Cincinnati, Ohio, where I hope to continue my studies in women's mythology
and the religious impulse in the Germanic cultures.  Happy Holidays (Happy
Holla-Days!) to all,

Dawn Work MaKinne
Des Moines, Iowa

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Folklore

Hi, Dawn!

It is nice to see you do your hibernal unlurking.

You wrote:

> First, a request. Would someone be willing to give the "gist" in
> English of "De Helderbut" kindly posted by Berend Klonne, the text
> by Grietje Clewits?

I took a stab at translating it from the Drenthe Low Saxon original, but I am
open to suggestions as to how to improve it.  I wasn't sure how to translate
_Helderbult_ and decided to leave it untranslated as a proper name.  As I
understand it, it is some sort of illuminated knoll or hillock.

Anyway, my draft translation follows the original below.

***

> De Helderbult
>
> Mamme, wat hoelt daor, zo hard buten deur
> dat döt de wiend jong,
> slaopen gaon heur
> Mamme wel lacht daor, is 't buten al licht
> Nee jong 't is nog duuster
> doe je oogies mar dicht
> jongie gaot slaopen. mar mamme is bang
> zie heurt in buuten, dudelijk zang
>
> As 't waait zo as now, en 't is duustere maon
> dan zul ze niet geern hen buuten gaon
> waant dan daansen de heksen, goelen al om
> de helderbult over al hen en weerom
> dan daansen de heksen, goelen al om
> de helderbult over al hen en weerom
> 't is buuten grauw, as de kleur van de nacht
> waaien heur na, 'n heks holt de wacht
> en kek dan 'n meens neischierig om de hoek
> dan kreg e in zien ogen,  'n klap met zo'n doek
> blind tot zien dood, moet e deur 't leven gaon
> dat hebt in de nacht, de heksen vaak daon.
>
> Mamme, wat hoelt daor, zo hard buten deur
> dat döt de wiend jong,
> slaopen gaon heur
> Mamme wel lacht daor, is 't buten al licht
> Nee jong 't is nog duuster
> doe je oogies mar dicht
> jongie gaot slaopen. mar mamme is bang
> zie heurt in buuten, dudelijk zang.

tekst: Grietje Clewits

***

The Helderbult

Mommy, what's howling there so hard outside?
It's the wind, son.
Go to sleep now! You hear?
Mommy, who's laughing there? Is it light out already?
No, son, it's still dark out.
Go on! Close your eyes!
The boy goes to sleep, but Mommy's afraid.
She clearly hears singing come in from outside.

As the wind blows like this, and the moon is obscured,
She isn't too keen on going outside,
For that's when they dance, the witches and ghouls, all around
the Helderbult, now across and now back.
That's when they all dance, the witches and ghouls, all around
the Helderbult, now across and now back.
It is gray outside. As the color of night
Follows her with the wind, a witch stands guard.
And should someone peer around the corner inquisitively,
He'd get hit in his eyes with some kind of rag,
Would have to go through life all blind in his eyes.
That's what at night witches have done many times.

Mommy, what's howling there so hard outside?
It's the wind, son.
Go to sleep now! You hear?
Mommy, who's laughing there? Is it light out already?
No, son, it's still dark out.
Go on! Close your eyes!
The boy goes to sleep, but Mommy's afraid.
She clearly hears singing come in from outside.

Lyrics: Grietje Clewits

***

Good luck with your application, Dawn, and a happy holiday season to you and
all Lowlanders!

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

---

P.S.: Tom wrote above:


denis dujardin <dujardin at pandora.be>


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