LL-L: "Shared Features" LOWLANDS-L, 02.JUN.2001 (02) [E]

Sat Jun 2 23:33:37 UTC 2001

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From: Criostoir O Ciardha <paada_please at yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: LL-L: "Shared features" LOWLANDS-L, 31.MAY.2001 (04) [E]

A chairde,

I apologise for the slight delay in replying.

Ron wrote:

"There are numerous Slavic-derived words in the
Eastern Low Saxon dialects (especially animal and
plant names, tools, household items), and some  of
them have made their way west; e.g., Low Saxon
_Pietsch_ 'whip' (cf.  German _Peitsche_ 'whip',
Sorbian _bi{c^}-_ 'to beat'), and _Döns_ 'front room',
'living room' (< Polabian *_d(v)ornicë_).  Perhaps
more important are linguistic features, such as
morphological ones (e.g., diminutive
_-ing_ ~ _-ink_ < Sl. _-inka_?) and phonological ones
(e.g., unrounding of front rounded vowels (/ü/ > /i/,
/ö/ > /e/), palatalization of /g/ and /k/)."

My immediate thoughts as I read this were
sociolinguistic: what can be said about the
relationship between Lowland Germanic and Slavic
speakers that meanings such as "whip" and "to beat"
are part of the shared vocabulary? What other loans
are there to further illustrate the social dialogue
between the two groups?

Of course to borrow the word "whip" does not imply
that there was any violence occurring between the two
human groups. The broad meaning of "whip" may have
come about through the loan of specific skills within,
say, shepherdy (to substantiate this I presume we
would have to look at the geophysical landscape -
i.e., is the area from which the loans are derived
good pasture, hill-farming, etc.?).

What in general was the relationship between the
Lowland Germanic peoples and the Slavs? Did one group
form a subjected strata (cf: English speakers as
peasants under Norman French-speaking domination in
England after 1066) or was it more equitable? If so,
which group was ascendant and which subject?

Phonological changes and substrates seem to indicate
substantial intermarriage (I personally abhor the term
as clumsy and inaccurate, but let us use it), or mass
language-shift (cf: Anglo-Irish - English with Gaelic
grammar, vocabulary and syntax). However, the changes
detailed by Ron appear very minor, particularly if we
compare the English of Ireland, which retains enormous
chunks of Gaelic phonology and very few "English"
sounds: what can we deduce was the scale of the
intermarriage/language shift?

Recurrence of a Slavic dimunitive ("-ing" < "-inka")
is particularly tantalising insofar as dimunitives on
the whole are a peculiar thing to borrow into a
language. Once again, Ireland provides a parallel: in
the native Germanic language of Ireland, Yola and
Fingalian (previously spoken in parts of Wexford,
Waterford and north Co. Dublin, descended from the Old
English of 1170 very little enriched by Gaelic due to
deliberate isolation), although borrowings from Gaelic
are limited to such things as Gaelic games (which
clearly could not be rationalised using existing Yola
lexical items), nonetheless the Irish dimunitive
suffix "-ín" (which I had taken to be a peculiarly
obsessive Connacht form, the Munster one being "-án")
is omnipresent - e.g. personal name "Tommeen" (Tom +
ín; "Tommy"). Why would a dimunitive of all things be
borrowed? In modern English local dimunitives are
particularly resilient to central decimation: is not
"-ie" a northern form? (e.g., "Jonnie", "Chrissie"
"Jamie" etc.) Nowadays it seems to have spread
troughout England.

Go raibh maith agaibh,

Críostóir.

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Shared features

Críostóir, Lowlanders,

> What other loans
> are there to further illustrate the social dialogue
> between the two groups?

As I said, ...

> There are numerous Slavic-derived words in the Eastern Low Saxon dialects

> (especially animal and plant names, tools, household items), and some of
them
> have made their way west;

I don't have a list.  There are bird names such as German _Zeisig_ 'siskin'
(cf. L. Sorb. _cy{z^}yk_, U.Sorb. _{c^}i{z^}ik_) and German _Stieglitz_, LS
_Stiegelitz_ ~ _Stiegelitsch_ ~ _Steilitsch_ 'goldfinch' (cf. L.Sorb.
_{s^}{c'}igelc_, U.Sorb. _{s^}{c]}ihlica_), several fish names (which I
don't remember right now), plant names such as German _Reizker_ 'orange
agaric' (a type of mushroom, cf. L.Sorb. _ryzyk_, Pol. _ryc_, Czech
_ryzec_), foods such as (late M.H.Germ. _twarc_ > _quarc_) German/LS
_Quark_ (similar to kefir cheese, cf. L.Sorb. _twarog_, U.Sorb. _twaroh_,
Pol. _twaróg_, Czech _tvaroh_), and the widespread word for  'border',
'boundary': German _Grenze_, LS _Grenz_ ~ _Grens_, Dutch _grens_ (cf.
L.Sorb. _granica_, U.Sorb. _hranica_, Pol. _granica_, Czech _hranice_).

> Recurrence of a Slavic dimunitive ("-ing" < "-inka")
> is particularly tantalising insofar as dimunitives on
> the whole are a peculiar thing to borrow into a
> language.

Not really.  It used to be assumed that morphology is resistant to
borrowing, but there are numerous instances of morphological borrowing,
including borrowing of diminutive suffixes, such as the Slavic-derived
adjectival diminutive suffix  _-inke_ in Yiddish (e.g., _kinderlach
kleyninke _ 'tiny/very young (cute) children').  My maternal grandfather
who was from Western Pomerania also transferred the LS _-ink_ suffix to
German to create familial terms of endearment (cf., _Muddink_ 'Mommy',
_Gretink_ 'Maggie').  A striking feature of Slavic languages is extensive
use of diminutive forms (equalled perhaps by Afrikaans); so it makes a lot
of sense to me that Low Saxon speakers of those regions picked this up.

> What in general was the relationship between the
> Lowland Germanic peoples and the Slavs? Did one group
> form a subjected strata (cf: English speakers as
> peasants under Norman French-speaking domination in
> England after 1066) or was it more equitable? If so,
> which group was ascendant and which subject?

There were cases of Germanic-Slavic intermarriage on the aristocratic
level, mostly as a means of official "bonding."  By and large, I suppose
you can say that Slavs tended to predominate on the lowest levels of
society -- cottage dwellers, serfs, farmhands, nursemaids, etc., but there
would have been many poor Germanic people on that level too, and after a
while they mixed.  (Even still in the early 20th century it was not
uncommon for Berlin high society to employ "Wendish" maids and nannies and
have them parade around in Spreewald costumes.)  There must have been Slavs
in the urban middle class also.  For instance, there are church records
stating that the church council of Zgorjelc/Zgorzelec/Görlitz, though
predominantly Sorbian, decided that Sorbian was unfit for worship and its
use ought to be discouraged and eventually prohibited.  Also, there are
many records of East German academics and artists and other "prominent"
people who still identified themselves as "Wends."  This was and is so
especially among Sorbs, many of whom have two sets of names: Sorbian and
German.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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