LL-L "Language varieties" 2001.11.02 (03) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 02.NOV.2001 (03) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian L=Limburgish
 LS=Low Saxon (Low German) S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
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From: AEDUIN at aol.com
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2001.11.01 (01) [E]

Sandy Fleming writes:

   but the standardisation shouldn't be taken to a national
   level just for the sake of having a national language, as has
   happened with English

I would take issue with the use of the word "just" but would also ask the
question as to what is wrong with a relatively standardised
language?
Communication is the primary function of language. Did the Australian
Aborigines benefit from the massive number of different
languages?
The Lowland merchant of any Mother language would have wanted to trade with
others outside his island or country.

Apart from sentiment and intellectual exercise what is the benefit of having a
minority language as a first language~? The language
reverenced is one that has been selected from a discrete moment in time. If it
is spoken easily and naturally as a real language then it will
develop and become standardised throughout its geographical area which could
be a whole country, such as happened with English.

Regards

Edwin Deady

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From: "Holger Weigelt" <platt at holger-weigelt.de>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2001.11.01 (03) [E]

Hello Hyazinth, Ron and all the others !
I just want to add the following remark to Your list: For East Frisia the
situation is somewhat more complicated than Your list suggests. First: For
some of the word there are more than one in existence. As examples: "wicht"
can also be "fón" and "wachten" is also "töyven" (and I could imagine that
"wachten" has come into use the more because it sounds nearer to German
"warten"). In the NE areas of (geographical and ethnical) East Frisia they
also say "snakken" instead of "proten".
The snakken/proten-borderline has to do with the old distinction between the
Weser-Frisian and the Ems-Frisian language varieties in EF that is present
in vocabulary differences and different pronounciations up to now.
For the phonematic: "proten" in EF is to be spoken with a long "o" sometimes
becoming a diphthongued "ou" or somewhat like "eu" (i.e. e-u, not the German
"eu" that sounds "oi") but never "ó" (the sound Ron gave orthographic
examples like "ao" "oa" for). The same long "o" You find in "moi" whereas
"fandóegh" (vandaag) has a "stressed" "ó"-sound.
[As I said in a former posting I regret not to be able to use some special
characters or phonetical (IPA) writing in here. If You like to find out more
about my opinions on orthography for East Frisian Platt (LS), have a look on
my website (http://www.holger-weigelt.de). Here in the list I try a
compromise - I can write the "stressed" vowels with the accent circonflexe,
the ó and  ä, ö, ü,  but not the stroke above the long vowels and the
ae-ligature. "gh" means the fricative of "g" for which I normally use "g"
with a small bow above. "v" stands for those cases where some speakers tend
to pronounce "w" but others "b", for example: óvend = evening - a problem is
the complexe system of shortenings in spoken EF Platt producing a large
number of monosyllable words or sentences being just a chain of syllables
only structured by tone differences by what "óvend" mostly becomes spoken
"ómd". For this reason we have to distinguish between the single word in its
pure form and its spoken appearance in differing contextes.]

Kind regards
Holger

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