LL-L "Grammar" 2002.06.03 (03) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 03.JUN.2002 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Grammar

Dear Lowlanders,

I responded to Reuben Epp's Mennonite Low Saxon (Plautdietsch) input:

> That's also how it is rendered in Northern Low Saxon (Low German):
>
> > Woo kjemmt daut, daut du hia noch sette deist?
> Wo kümmt dat, dat du hier noch sitten deist?
>
> > Woo kjemmt daut, daut dit Zeig (Stoff) hia noch romligje deit?
> Wo kümmt dat, dat dat Tüüg hier noch rümliggen deit.
>
> Semantically, these are a bit different: (1) they express "how come
> ...?" (rather than disapprovingly "what ... for?"), and (2) they don't
> *necessarily* express disapproval of the duration, could also express
> surprise.
>
> I am not familiar with the specific pattern as given by Hermann-Winter
> in Northern dialects, specifically expressing (undesirably) extended
> action:
>
> > Wat deist du hier tau sitten?
> > (Wat daaist dôê hier taau zitn?)
> * Wat deist du hier to sitten?
>
> > Wat sall dat Tüüchs noch rümtauliggen daun?
> > (Wat zal dat tuugs noch rumtaaulign daaun?)
> * Wat s(ch)all dat Tüügs noch rümtoliggen doon?
>
> This also works:
>
> > If you continue to walk here....
> > Wan du wiedahan hia gohne deist ....
> Wenn du wiederhen hier gahn deist, ...
>
> Using the pattern discussed (apparently implying disapproval), it should
> theoretically be ...
>
> * Wan du hia too gohne deist, ...
> * Wenn du hier to gahn deist, ...
> If go keep on walking here ...

In fairness to Reuben's input, I ought to add that in the second example
...

Wat sall dat Tüüchs noch rümtauliggen daun?
(Wat zal dat tuugs noch rumtaaulign daaun?)
* Wat s(ch)all dat Tüügs noch rümtoliggen doon?

... _rümliggen_ (Plautdietsch _romligje_) 'lie around' already implies
disapproval, which renders _Wo kümmt dat, dat dat Tüüg hier noch
rümliggen deit?_ (Plautdietsch _Woo kjemmt daut, daut dit Zeig (Stoff)
hia noch romligje deit?_) 'How come this stuff is still lying around
here' close in meaning to _Wat sall dat Tüüchs noch rümtauliggen daun?_,
although apparently it does not have element of implying an unduly long
period, which _rümtauliggen daun_ does.

Also, _Wat ...?_ in this context clearly expresses disapproval, much
like English _What ... for?_ (What's that stuff supposed to keep lying
around for?), while _Wo kümmt dat, dat ...?_ (Plautdietsch _Woo kjemmt
daut, daut ...?_) does not necessarily express disapproval, much like
English "How come ...?"  Furthermore, _Wat ...?_ here asks for a
purpose, while _Wo kümmt dat, dat ...?_ only asks for a reason or
cause.  In other words, the difference is "For what purpose are you
keeping that stuff lying around here?" vs "What is the reason that that
stuff is lying around here?"

I would render Mecklenburg/Western Pomerania dialect _Wat deist du hier
tau sitten?_ as _Wat deist du hier rümsitten_ 'What are you sitting
around here for?' or better 'What do you keep sitting here around for?',
where _rüm..._ '... around', '... about' adds the element of disapproval
in that it implies 'sitting around idly/unnecessarily/uninvitedly'.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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