LL-L "Etymology" 2002.05.12 (02) [E/LS]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 12.MAY.2002 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: "Friedrich-Wilhelm.Neumann" <Friedrich-Wilhelm.Neumann at epost.de>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2002.05.10 (03) [E]

Wim wrote:
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Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2002.05.10 (03) [E]

Hi!
In my dialec here in salland we don't say be, bessen like in dutch
normaly..
We say [ beezn]. with a zed. Eerebeezn, rooie beezn, etc.( straw berries
red berries etc) we don't use the singular I think for berries. Can't
remember.

So that would connect it with an end of word z or R maybe? I have no
idea.

(Wim verdoold

Ron wrote:
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Subject: Etymology

Wim,

You may have hit on something interesting here.  There is this ancient
Germanic -z ~ -r thing going on (the rune named "Elhaz" or "Algiz" --
meaning 'elk' -- being supposed to represent a sound "between z and r"),
and my hunch is that 'berry' falls into this category.

So, between you and me we have "discovered" that in Low Saxon alone
there is this -z ~ -r variation in the word for 'berry': (*/beeze/ >)
/beez/ (-> pl. /beez+n/ ['be:zn]) versus (*/beere/) > /beer/ (-> pl.
/beer+n/ [be:3n]).  I assume that the Dutch version started off with
/-z@/, then dropped the schwa (> /-z/) and finally phonemically devoiced
it to /-s/.

Here is another example in Low Saxon (Low German), the verb 'to freeze':
some dialects have /freiz-/ and other dialects have /freir-/.

Low Saxon (Low German):
(first phonemic, then in German style spelling)
to freeze:      freiz-n ~ freir-n (fresen ~ freren/freen)
I freeze:       ik freiz(-e) ~ freir(-e) (ik frees' ~ freer)
thou freezest:  duu früz-st (du früst)
he freezes:     hei früz-t (he früst)
we freeze:      wii freir-t ~ freir-n (wi freert ~ freren/freern)
I froze:        ik frour (ik froor)
we froze:       wii frour-n (wi froren ~ froorn)
frozen:         frour-n ~ fraar-en (froren/froorn ~ fraren/fraarn)
frost:          frost

Dutch:    German:       English:        Low Saxon:
vriezen   frieren       freeze          frezen ~ freern
vries     friere        freeze          freez(e) ~ freer(e)
vriest    frierst       freeze(st)      früst
vriest    friert        freezes         früst
vriezen   frieren       freeze          freert ~ freern
vroor     fror          froze           froor
vroren    froren        froze           froorn
gevroren  gefroren      frozen          froorn ~ fraarn
vorst     Frost         frost           Frost

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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Hi,

perhaps? another example:

German:                English:                Low Saxon:
quer                      cross                   dwars, but also dweir,
queir
querulieren            grumble                queisen
Querulant               grumbler               Queiser

Regards,

Fiete

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From: "Friedrich-Wilhelm.Neumann" <Friedrich-Wilhelm.Neumann at epost.de>
Subject: Etymology

Dear Lowlanners,

in our regional Low-Saxon (near the mouth of the Elbe river) farmers
call a young, but non-pregnant cow *quein* (phonetic: kvei:n). It sounds
so similar to the engl. *Queen* that I suppose there must be any
relationship between these words. I could not find out yet their common
roots, just besides the fact, that both of them appoint to something
female.

Regards

Fiete

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