LL-L "Language learning" 2002.11.20 (06) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 20.NOV.2002 (06) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
 L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic
               V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: Ruud Harmsen <rh at rudhar.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language learning" 2002.11.20 (05) [E/S]

>I'm afraid I have to agree with you, John Magnusu.  It takes an
awful lot of
>motivation and self-discipline for an English speaker (native or
fluently
>non-native) to learn languages of countries in which the majority
of people
>possess fair to good English proficiency, and this would be most of
Europe,
>certainly in urban settings, especially Northwestern Europe.

I recognize this situation, from camp-sites in Portugal, where I
didn't want to speak English or French, because part of the reason I
was there was to improve my Portuguese. But some receptionists,
hearing it wasn't very good (and it wasn't, especially not after a
long drive without much sleep), insisted on replying in French while
I kept trying to speak Portuguese to them. My skills in both these
languages are equally feeble, although workable, and understanding
one and speaking the other proved very tiring and confusing.

On other occasions, in France, my totally exhausted attempts to
speak French were met with unexpected fellow Dutch speakers' tiredom
behind behind the desk. Wat moet je dan? Dan toch maar weer
Nederlands ...

>(Many a feeble attempt of mine to use Dutch
>has earned me well-meaning and welcome private feedback from Dutch
speakers
>on the List.

I think your Dutch is quite good, judging from a private message you
sent recently. I will get back to you about a subtle vocabulary
issue though, one that is so subtle I find it difficult myself, as a
native speaker.
--
Ruud Harmsen <rh at rudhar.com>
Site updated 20 Nov 2002: http://rudhar.com/index/whatsnew.htm
Switchable colours

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language learning

I responded to a message from John Magnus Tait:

> I'm afraid I have to agree with you, John Magnusu.

Sorry.  This was a simple typo, not an attempted Japanese, Swahili or Old
Saxon rendering of your name, John Magnus.

Ruud wrote (above):

> I think your Dutch is quite good, judging from a private message you
> sent recently.

Thanks, Ruud. {blushing}  I'm trying.  And LL-L is great because people are
so forgiving.  In the case of Dutch, as in cases of other Lowlands
languages, proximity is the only enemy ... well, that and laziness, I guess.
When you understand a language well, and that language is really closely
related to another language you know, it tends to get quite hard to tune in
fully and to muster the self-discipline to resist "making up stuff" on the
basis of the the known related language(s).

I found a method that works quite well for me, in addition to reading (both
text and theory): listening to tapes and CDs while performing "non-thinking"
jobs, such as peeling broccoli, installing a fire alarm, scrubbing bathtubs,
and the like.  I've been doing this with Dutch, Afrikaans and Westerlauwer
Frisian recordings, and lately I found that it works really well with the
(quite excellent) CDs that come with "Wir Ain Collin's" superb Scots
textbook (http://www.luath.co.uk/book/language_scotslearner.htm).  Playing
them over and over -- no matter if you listen intently or not -- not only
reinforces (almost subconsciously) grammar, lexicon and idiom, but it also
does wonders to your "accent."  (But, alas, I've been told to cut down on
speaking with a Scotish aaccent aroond the hoose, unless I'm by myself.)

> I will get back to you about a subtle vocabulary
> issue though, one that is so subtle I find it difficult myself, as a
> native speaker.

Bij voorbaat bedankt, Ruud.  Subtle is good, but -- uh-oh! -- it's not one
of those embarrassing boo-boos, is it?  Like giving my Dutch messages
unintended sexual twists, which has happened twice (that I'm aware of), and
people told me about it very politely, almost compassionately, in private.

Thanks and groetjes!
Reinhard/Ron

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