No subject

Sat Oct 19 23:24:02 UTC 2002

======================================================================
 L O W L A N D S - L * 19.OCT.2002 (01) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
 Web Site: <http://www.lowlands-l.net>  Email: admin at lowlands-l.net
 Rules & Guidelines: <http://www.lowlands-l.net/rules.htm>
 Posting Address: <lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org>
 Server Manual: <http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html>
 Archive: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html>
=======================================================================
 You have received this because have been subscribed upon request. To
 unsubscribe, please send the command "signoff lowlands-l" as message
 text from the same account to <listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org> or
 sign off at <http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html>.
=======================================================================
 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
 L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic
               V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
=======================================================================

From: Stan Levinson <stlev99 at yahoo.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2002.10.18 (05) [E]

(Stan's reply below)
From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language varieties
I basically agree with you that the Australian
phonetic output of /ar/
is
somewhat higher and more fronted than the Bostonian
one.  However,
there are
many shades of Australian (and probably several of
Bostonian), and some
of
them go farther on the scale than others.  Most people
I know divide
them
into "broad Australian" and "educated Australian" (the
latter
predominating
in the electronic media).  The /ar/ -> [a:] sound
tends to be somewhat
higher and more fronted ("fletter") in the former than
in the latter,
but it
is not quite [æ:] or [E:] either.

What I had really meant to say was that the phonetic
realizations of
/ar/ in
Bostonian, general New England, Australian and New
Zealand dialects are
similar to each other, in the same ballpark as opposed
to most other
dialects of English (including those of New York), and
Lowlands Saxon
(LS)
fits in with them.

...
Again, I generally agree with you, but at the same
time remind you that
there is dialectal and sociolectal variation, and most
people outside
Australia are not quite aware of that.  If I had to
instruct anyone in
how
to start putting on an Australian accent (without
being able to pull it
off
myself) I would begin with suggesting to "try and
speak mostly in the
front
of your mouth".  Yes, it is almost as though the
entire vowel allophone
inventory has been shifted toward the front and also a
bit up.  As in
many
dialects of Southern England, the output of /oo/ as in
_go_ or _boat_
is
something like [e.}] (ending with a central, slightly
rounded vowel or
glide, very similar in many Northern Lowlands Saxon
dialects).  Yes,
the
Australian /uu/ realization (e.g., "too") seems to be
something like
[}:]
(like long _u_ in some Swedish varieties), a sound in
between [u:] and
[y:]
and with little rounding, almost [1:].  I hear the
short /u/ (e.g.,
"good")
pronounced with little or no rounding, almost [1]
(central, between [I]
and
[W]).

However, there do seem to be some back vowels anyway,
such as [O]
(e.g.,
"pot"), [o:] (e.g., "thought"), and [AI] ~ [QI] ~ [OI]
(e.g., "die,"
often
slightly rounded, as opposed to [aI], e.g., "day").

Much of this seems to apply to New Zealand varieties
as well.  The only
feature of NZ "accents" that to my ear sounds special
(from my
pseudo-Australian viewpoint) is that the short /e/, as
in "bed," is
pronounced even more frontal and higher than its
Australian
counterpart,
something like [e], approaching [I].  I hear a similar
sound in some
South
African English dialects.

Ron,
Thanks for the analysis.  One thing that I have picked
up from (non-linguistic specialist) Australians is
that they tend to say that they cannot tell where a
person is from in Australia by accent.  I find this
interested because you can hear differences (from my
brief experience in Oz) in preference of [a] vs. [ae],
and also I just had a kind of intangible different
feel to the sound of South Australians vs. NSW (my
only experience).
Regarding the back vowels, yeah, I didn't even think
about the AI/OI and O (pot).  I guess our inverted
vowel triangle, aside from being moved a bit forward,
can be pulled a bit out of shape to include back
vowels that tend toward the low side.
As for NZ vowels, I've seen Australian writing
portraying a NZ speaker and writing "bist" for "best",
so I guess they perceive the same thing.
I suppose you've heard the old joke, re Aussie
English, of WWII vintage: the American GI is in a
hospital staffed by Aussie nurses.  The scared GI asks
"Nurse, have I come here to die?"  Answers the nurse
cheerily (I said she's Australian!!!), "Why no, love,
you came here yesterday."
Stan

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language varieties

G'die, Stan, Lowlanders!

Stan:
> One thing that I have picked
> up from (non-linguistic specialist) Australians is
> that they tend to say that they cannot tell where a
> person is from in Australia by accent.

Yeah, I've heard that too, but I've also heard other people claim that they
can *always* tell a "Sydneysider," a "Darwinian," etc.  I think that, like
everywhere in the world, regional differences are fading away and there are
going to be more sociolects than regional dialects.

> I suppose you've heard the old joke, re Aussie
> English, of WWII vintage: the American GI is in a
> hospital staffed by Aussie nurses.  The scared GI asks
> "Nurse, have I come here to die?"  Answers the nurse
> cheerily (I said she's Australian!!!), "Why no, love,
> you came here yesterday."

Yes, that's a good one.  Here's a real-life one, between two guys
(roommates) I knew in an international setting, one from the U.S. and the
other from Australia.  In the morning, the American roommate opened the
curtain, a daily ritual to help the other guy wake up.  The Australian
asked, "Is it late ("lite") yet?", and the American said, "Open your eyes,
man!"

Cheers!
Reinhard/Ron

==================================END===================================
* Please submit postings to <lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org>.
* Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
* Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
* Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l") are
  to be sent to <listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org> or at
  <http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html>.
=======================================================================