LL-L "Language varieties" 2003.07.31 (06) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 31.JUL.2003 (06) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: Gustaaf Van Moorsel <gvanmoor at aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2003.07.31 (01) [E]

Justin Renquist wrote:

> Do you pronounce your r's in Dutch with a guttural/uvular sound, tongue
> trilled, or a combination depending on the word or who you are talking to?
> How would you as a native Dutch speaker explain the differences between
> users of uvular vs trilled r in Dutch? To an ABN speaker, do trilled r's
> come across as sounding like dialect, regional, and do trilled r's to ABN
> speakers have a negative connotation of lwoer socio-economic class?
> Your input greatly appreciated! :>

I'd say definitely not tongue trilled.  In fact, like many Dutch,
I have difficulty pronouncing r's in languages such as Russian and
Spanish.  I don't think, though, that tongue trilled r's have a
negative connotation of lower socio-economic class.

Gustaaf

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From: Gustaaf Van Moorsel <gvanmoor at aoc.nrao.edu>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2003.07.31 (01) [E]

Luc van Oekene schreef:

> I think you also have to listen (and look) to the official Flemish
> television and radio (VRT). They  have a standard Dutch which also has
> an official caracter.

That's a good point, and I think it illustrates my distinction
between speaking with an accent and speaking ABN.  I would clas-
sify the Dutch of Flemish newsreaders definitely as ABN, even
though only one or two words would suffice for me to tell they
are Flemish - just as Luc would be able to tell I was Dutch in
a microsecond or so.

What I was deploring is a general sloppiness in pronunciation
and grammar which seems to pervade Dutch media.  But maybe I
am just an old curmudgeon who has been away from home for too
long!

Gustaaf

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language varieties

Gustaaf (above):

> But maybe I
> am just an old curmudgeon who has been away from home for too
> long!

:)  Uh-oh!  But we love you all the same.  There ought to be a club or list
for such people.  I know I would consider joining.

Cheers!
Reinhard/Ron

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