LL-L "Delectables" 2004.12.03 (05) [E]

Fri Dec 3 17:44:22 UTC 2004

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From: Críostóir Ó Ciardha <paada_please at yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: LL-L "Delectables" 2004.12.02 (08) [E]

Ron wrote:
"That would be *West* Slavic. I've always assumed my family wasn't typical
of our area because we didn't quite have the same sort of diet as our
neighbors (e.g., didn't eat kale for Christmas) and ate some things that
others didn't or rarely did. When later I became intellectually aware of
our partial Slavonic origin due to westward migration (my parents being the
first generation born in the Hamburg area) I often suspected this to be at
least in part Eastern, Slavonic-based heritage. The many cold fruit soups
(especially cherry or elderberry soups topped with beaten eggwhite puffs) we
ate in summer may be a part of that, as may have been clotted sour milk with
sugar, various buttermilk dishes, including what seems to be Sorbian _kwasna
poliwka_ "wedding soup," millet cooked in buttermilk, and also turnip and
rutabaga (swede) mush with mutton. Oh, and not to forget stuffed cabbage
rolls (which are very popular all over Central and East ern Europe)!"

I mentioned East Slavic influences because in my experience Polish and Czech
cuisine always reminded me more of German, Austrian and Hungarian cooking -
hardly a suprise given the imperial confluences between them all. I used to
have a "Peoples of the Soviet Union" cook book, and Baltic cooking in
particular (emphasis on herring, for instance) reminded me greatly of a
number of Atlantic dishes.

But then cooking is not so diverse an art, and anyone who lives by the sea
will generally create similar dishes to anyone else who lives by the sea,
even if those two people are separated by tens of thousands of miles.

Considering that cuisine is a more readily transferred cultural accroutement
than anything else (look at the global diffusion of 'foreign' cooking styles
in our times), is it really right for us to refer to "Slavic" or "Lowlandic"
or "Celtic" cuisines? Surely climate is the determining factor? Is there any
a Slav or Lowlander eats (ate) that a Celt wouldn't for cultural reasons,
and vice versa? (I have always had a strong aversion to the jelly in which
tinned meat sits (a prime ingredient of pork pies, I hasten to add - one
reason why I don't eat), and wouldn't touch aspic if you paid me, thereby
ruling out many Russian and German dishes. But is that a cultural reason?)

Go raibh maith agat,

Criostóir?

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From: Brooks, Mark <mark.brooks at twc.state.tx.us>
Subject: LL-L "Delectables" 2004.12.02 (08) [E]

Glorifying grits Ron wrote:  "...it is wildly loved among many African
Americans and other folks with Southern heritage."

Now, Ron, chitlin's are also loved by many a Southerner, but that doesn't
mean you would have to eat them!  I've never had the pleasure (not) of
eating chitlin's, but I've heard enough about them to make sure I never do.
I will admit though, that if I had to choose between grits and chitlin's it
would be no contest - I'd go for the grits every time.  I've known many
people here in Texas that have a fondness for chitlin's, and I also know
that they have to cook them outside of the house by order of the rest of the
house's residents!  The "aroma" of cooking chitlin's was described by one
connoisseur as the smell "when the sewer backs up into your house."

However, the "National Food of Texas" is really Tex-Mex.  Now, THERE'S
something that can't be beat!

Mark Brooks

P.S. Uh...not menudo though.

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Delectables

Críostóir (above):

> I mentioned East Slavic influences because in my experience Polish
> and Czech cuisine always reminded me more of German, Austrian
> and Hungarian cooking - hardly a suprise given the imperial
> confluences between them all.

Well, yes, Críostóir, but one should never be too sure about the direction
influences flowed.  Was Czech cuisine German- and Magyar-influenced or was
it the other way around?  Were Czech cooks just brilliant synthesizers of
foreign transfers?  At any rate, to employ a "Bohemian" cook was certainly
most prestigious among better-to-do Austrian imperials.

But I totally agree with your statement that cuisine is easily transferrable
culture, and I would add to that oral literature (folktales and such).
These can be rapidly nativized after importation, and tracing them back to
their sources can be extremely difficult, literary evidence usually being
late and sketchy.  Potatoes, tomatoes, peppers (both seeds and fruits) and
various herbs and spices reached Europe really pretty recently when seen in
the great scheme of things.  Yet, where would European cuisines be without
them?  Can you imagine German, Austrian, Netherlandic and Scandinavian
Christmas baking without cinnamon, cardamon and all the other good aromatic
spices that reached Europe primarily by way of Netherlands East Indies
imports?

It seems to happen regularly that colonizing peoples' cuisines adapt to
those of the peoples they colonize and/or enslave.  You can see this most
clearly all over the Americas, also in Southern Africa and in Australia, New
Zealand and throughout the Pacific Islands region.  I am sure that this did
not happen because the colonizers were in love with the cultures of those
they colonized.  Much rather, it was a matter of survival, necessitating
adaptation to local produce and its uses.  This may not have been quite as
dramatic in the case of Germanic populations (with basically Scandinavian
roots) colonizing Slavonic and Celtic populations, but I can imagine that it
applied to some degree as well.

When outside Europe I feel like having "back-home-comfort-food," especially
while traveling in North America, I don't often seek out German restaurants,
because they tend to rely mostly on southern (especially Allemannic and
Bayuvarian) cuisine.  Sometimes Scandinavian and Dutch restaurants have what
I crave -- sort of, their versions of familiar dishes often "not tasting
quite right," typically due to what to me seems like excessive sweetness.
Polish and Ashkenazi Jewish restaurants are more likely to offer things that
hit the spot, such as their pickles tasting "home-like."  This may be
indicative of me having an "east-leaning" culinary background.

Mark (above, accusing me of "glorification"):

> Now, Ron, chitlin's are also loved by many a Southerner, but that doesn't
> mean you would have to eat them!  I've never had the pleasure (not) of
> eating chitlin's, but I've heard enough about them to make sure I never
do.
> I will admit though, that if I had to choose between grits and chitlin's
it
> would be no contest - I'd go for the grits every time.  I've known many
> people here in Texas that have a fondness for chitlin's, and I also know
> that they have to cook them outside of the house by order of the rest of
the
> house's residents!  The "aroma" of cooking chitlin's was described by one
> connoisseur as the smell "when the sewer backs up into your house."

Ooh, nice!  For those of you who don't know what "chitlins" (< "chitlings" <
"chitterlings," originally meaning "rags" or "tatters") are, let me hasten
to explain that we are talking animals' (usually pigs') intestines here ...
(and menudo, which Mark also mentions, is a Mexican soup containing tripe,
i.e., stomach lining).

Some Americans with Southern roots, especially African Americans, continue
this itestinal culinary tradition even in the North, which is why you can
find chitlins sold (usually frozen) particularly in areas with high
concentrations of African Americans.  I've never eaten them, and the look
and smell don't exactly entice me to even try them.  It's an acquired taste;
you have to grow up eating them.  I once attended a Christmas party in which
the house was beautifully decorated but all the lovely Christmas smells had
been drowned out by the smell of chitlins which the hostess had the bright
idea cooking ... at a party at which the majority of guests were Northerners
...  After a while, people, sitting and standing around with what looked
like forced, frozen smiles, stopped being polite and just opened all the
doors and windows ...  :-)

Never a dull moment!

> However, the "National Food of Texas" is really Tex-Mex.  Now,
> THERE'S something that can't be beat!

Well, I don't know about the "can't be beat" part, but I agree that it hits
as pretty high spot on my "culinarimeter."  (For those who do not already
know, we are talking about a blend of Texan and Mexican cuisines, Texas
having been a part of Mexico once.  Imagine hot North Mexican cuisine using
more copious amounts of meat ...)

Folks, I hope Sinteklaas will bring you something nicer than that this
coming Monday.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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