LL-L "Etymology" 2005.07.21 (05) [B/E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 21.JUL.2005 (05) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West) Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: Þjóðríkr Þjóðreksson <didimasure at hotmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Lexicon" 2005.07.21 (07) [E/LS]


To Mr. Hellinckx: is d'afkomst van "vlietig" dezelfste as die van 't Algemië 
Neiderlaans wourd "vlijtig" oef ni?

Paul Finlow Bates: I think beek/bekr/... in English has changed to beach. 
(with the ch because it's an old i-stem, baki-)

Doederik Masure

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From: heather rendall <HeatherRendall at compuserve.com>
Subject: LL-L "Lexicon" 2005.07.21 (07) [E/LS]

Message text written by INTERNET:lowlands-l at LOWLANDS-L.NET
>"Beek" is an iteresting one.  Our  becks in England are virtually all in
the
former Danelaw, from ON "bekr", but the existance of a Lowlands beek
suggests there should be a more direct Old English relative.
<

The word that appears in the Saxon Charters of our village   is bece
which moved into dialect as  batch   and appears in many places names as
such.

So would   bece   have been sounded as  'beche' ? Not from the sound of
'beek'

Can anyone suggest an explanation?

Heather

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From: R. F. Hahn <lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net>
Subject: Etymology

Thanks for the terrific lead, Heather.  I've long wondered about that word.

English "beck," which now survives mostly in place names, comes from OE 
_becc_ which comes from Norse _bekkr_.  The _bece_ (or _bæce_) you mentioned 
survived as "bache" (rivulet, river dale) until not terribly long ago but is 
now obsolete.

I'm not sure if it has been actually established if in the very beginning of 
Old English <c> was pronounced consistently [k] or if it had already come 
with Frisian-like palatalization before front vowels.  (Old Frisian doesn't 
seem to have a cognate of this, by the way.)  I am inclined to believe that 
<c> started of as consistent [k] but that the language came with a possibly 
Frisian-fed palatalization tendency that came to the fore in certain 
dialects and then spread to most of the language.  So, in this case _bece_ 
would have developed as ["be:k@] > ["be:kj@] > ["be:tS@].

Similarly:
chin < OE ci = OF kin, OS kinni
beech <  OE bóece, béce, OS bôka

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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