LL-L "Etymology" 2006.02.26 (03) [E]

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   L O W L A N D S - L * 26 February 2006 * Volume 03
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From: Ed Alexander <edsells at cogeco.ca>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2006.02.26 (01) [E]

At 01:07 PM 02/26/06 -0800, Ron wrote:

>Nice try, but apparently no cigar, I'm afraid.  According to the _Oxford
>English Dictionary_, "divers" (now with main stress on the first syllable,
>earlier on the second) comes from Old French _divers_ ~ _diviers_
>(feminine _diverse_ ~ _divierse_), related to Latin _divers-_ (_diversus_
>etc.), originally "turned different ways," then 'unlike', 'different',
>'separate', 'contrary'.  In English it acquired the meanings 'perverse',
>and the like, which, yes, makes it semantically very much related to
>archaic native "twart."
>
>Is there a Romance-Germanic link?  We'd first have to show that Romance
>_di-_ consistently corresponds to Germanic _th(V)-_ and Romance _di+v..._
>consistently corresponds to Germanic _thw-_.  This may be a tall
>order.  For one thing, there aren't all that many Germanic words of that 
>type.
>
>Hmmm ... By the same token, take a look at Old English _þwítan_
>(_þwát_, _þwiten_) 'to cut (off)', which gave archaic Modern English
>"to thwite" 'to cut (down/away)', 'to whittle', 'to shape by paring'.  In
>Old Norse it corresponds to _þveita_ 'small ax', _þvita_ 'type of ax',
>_þveit(i)_ 'land division', 'parcel of land'.  And, yes, "whittle" is a
>form of "thwittle" ('whittling knife', 'to whittle'), assumedly a
>diminutive form.  Note also that Scots has derived _hwite_, _white_,
>_quhyte_ and _fite_ from Old English _þwítan_.  (So there's the old
>_þw-_ ~ _kw-_ thing again.)  This makes you (well, me) wonder if there is
>a connection with Latin _di+vid-_ (_dividere_) 'to divide'.
>
>If there's something to your hunch, Ed, then we'd also be led to assume a
>connection between "thwart" (~ _dwar(+s)_ ~ _dwer(+s)_) and Romance
>_di+vert-_ (> English "divert"), cf. Latin _divertere_ 'to turn in
>different directions', 'to turn out of the way', which apparently has been
>fused with Latin _dēvertere_ 'to turn aside'.  The Romance root here is
>_vert-_ (Latin _vertere_) 'to turn' (> English "to vert").
>
>There may be an earlier root: *_ver-_, and I wonder if *_vēr_ (> Italian
>_(prima-)vera_, English "ver(e)") 'early part of the warm season'
>'springtime' (when the year and weather turn) is related to it (cf. 
>"vernal").
>
>Note also (French _virer_ >) English "to veer" and archaic "to vire" 'to
>turn'.
>
>So, Ed, as I go along on your tentative garden path I begin wondering if
>you won't get your cigar after all -- and that would be a big, old Cuban
>one of the the best order.  ;-)

Well, you'd have to come over the border for that one, eh?

>Going out on a limb even further, this makes me wonder about Germanic
>*_kēr-_ 'turn', 'to turn', namely if an old _-w-_ came to be elided (as
>e.g. in _kom-_   _kwam-_ 'come'   'came')  [cf. Low Saxon _keyr_,
>_keyren_ (<K(i)ehr>, <k(i)ehrn>), Dutch _keer_, _keren_, German _kehren_,
>Old Saxon _kērian_, Old German _kēran_].
>
>I suppose that either the plot is thickening or the limb is bending ...

Thanks.  When I get it, it will go up on the wall with the Golden Squirrel
Award.  I knew about the derivation from Old French, and the connection to
the old Latin and IE roots.  The Germanic morphology was beyond me, but I
suspected something from the basic sense of the word.

Ed Alexander, S.O.G.S.

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

Hi again, Ed!

> Well, you'd have to come over the border for that one, eh?

'Fraid so.

> Thanks.  When I get it, it will go up on the wall with the Golden Squirrel
> Award.

Sure.  And you still haven't received that one.  Right?  Boy!  Doesn't that 
one take us way back?  (I've even forgotten the details, must have them in 
the old, unpublished archive.)

Oh, and not to forget the Hawaiian name, assuming you got one and, unlike 
someone we both know, appreciate the honor that comes with the gesture.

Take care!
Reinhard/Ron 

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