LL-L 'Language varieties' 2007.02.06 (06) [E/German]

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Tue Feb 6 18:09:01 UTC 2007


L O W L A N D S - L - 06 February 2007 - Volume 06

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From: Karl-Heinz Lorenz <Karl-Heinz.Lorenz at gmx.net>
Subject: LL-L 'Grammar' 2007.02.04 (09) [E,German,Kanak-Sprak]

> From: Dirk Mahling <dmahling at acm.org>
> Subject: LL-L 'Grammar' 2007.02.04 (07) [E.German]
>
> So, Gabriele, now that you have eludicated us all to the use of Genitiv
> and
> Dativ in German, all I can say is:
>
> „Man gewoehnt sich an allem, sogar am Dativ."
>
> Dirk Mahling

Hey, this is very good. It reminds me of an article about the tendency of
non-native German speakers to use only the dative (for both genitive and
accusative) and "dem" as the only article.

Now I found something after googleing:

http://www.detlev-mahnert.de/Jugendsprache.html

and from:

http://www.detlev-mahnert.de/kanak.html :

"Da warn ma swei Typn vor Mc Donalds, dem Stefan Hase und dem Murat Igel,
weisstu! Dem Stefan hatte krasse Benz mit sekksundertern Maschine, dem
anderen hatte 3ern mit einsekksern Maschine. Un als dem ma Burgern un Pommes
gefressen ham, hat dem Murat dem Stefan angelabert: "Alder, dein Maschine is
scheissndreck!" "Halts Maul du Penner, isch schwör! Deim 3ern versäg ich mit
600ern in Ruckwärtsgang!" hat dem Stefan gesagt, "Abern ok, machen wirn
krasse Race. Immern von eim zum nächstem Ampeln, ok?".

This is called Kanak-Sprak, Kanakisch etc. and is a simplified German mainly
spoken by Turkish youths in Germany but also influential on young people's
language and German Slang.

Gabriele hat dem Karl-Heinz geschrieben:
> Und über dem Geschmack seine Fragen lässt sich bekanntlich nicht
> streiten...
> wenn ich es auch gern tun täte!

Bin heute in Fruh aufgestanden, habe Fruhstuck gehabt un bin dann mit
Straßenbahn nach Arbeit. Hat da echt gestunken in dem Straßenbahn, isch
schwör, voll schlechtem Geschmack, echt krass, ey.

> However, in Hannover, the "ei" diphthong is pronounced
> as "aa". So, what the good woman hears is: "Haben Sie Eile?" ("Are you in
> a
> hurry?" instead of "Have you got eels?"). To which she answers: "Naan, ich
> höbe Zaat!" ("Nein, ich habe Zeit!" - "No, I've got time!"). Note also
> that
> the vowel "a" is pronounced as "ö" in Hannover.
>
> Soviel zum "Konservendeutsch". In diesem Fall eine Fischkonserve.

Dem kann isch net glauben. Schwöre dass dem stimmt, ohn Scheiss. Machst dem
Spass mit mir? Is dem Karnevalsprache? „Naan, isch höbe Zaat" so wie dem
„Dra Chinasan mat da Kantrabass"? Du lügst mir doch! Sagt ihr auch dem:
aans, zwaa, draa gsuffa! Und „Allaa wia a Staa" Wenn dem so is, dann tut
mensch in Hannover dem Bairisch sprechen un Braunschweig is doch dem
Niedersachsen sein Bayrisch Kolonie.

Dem sind noch ein paar links:

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanak_Sprak
http://www.uni-essen.de/linguistik.buenting/Kanaksprak.ppt#269,1,Kanak Sprak
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutschrussisch
http://www.strannik.de/quelia/

Gabriele:

> "Hannoversches Wörterbuch" (which is to be kept from Karl-Heinz at all
costs)

Her mit dem Buch. Wenngeht kauf isch dem Buch auch, ohn Scheiss. Weisstu,
Salman Rushdie liest auch dem Koran!

Ciao schwör isch
Karl-Heinz

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language varieties

Folks,

For those of you who don't know German and are not familiar with the jargons
mentioned here, let me just add that Kanak-Sprak and Kanakisch are German
jargons supposedly used by and in some cases used with immigrants (including
"guest workers"), typically non-European ones (including Turks), and these
have developed to "alternative" lingos in some circles.  Apparently they
evolved from Türkendeutsch ("Turks' German"), a type of slang German with
Turkish interference, which I suspect to be partly "dramatized" by native
German speakers that mock it or describe it (a bit like pseudo-Yiddish
before the end of World War II, or these days the mocking of "Mexican
English" in the US Southwest, and that of South Asian and West Indian
English in Britain).

The naming clearly reveals racism and/or xenophobia.  Kanak, Kanaker* etc.
(perhaps not directly related to "Canuck" 'Canadian', but it may have
influenced it) are approximately equivalent to "wog" in non-American
English.

* from Hawaiian kanaka 'human being', 'man', 'mankind', typically
'indigenous person(s)', developed from Polynesian tangata lit. "that/those
that have been (here) before," originally used to refer to Polynesians
transported as laborers to Queensland ("Kanakaland"), Australia -- possibly
introduced into German via sailors' jargon

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
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