LL-L "Etymology" 2007.10.31 (01) [E/S]

Wed Oct 31 14:56:28 UTC 2007

L O W L A N D S - L  -  31 October 2007 - Volume 01
Song Contest: lowlands-l.net/contest/ (- 31 Dec. 2007)
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From: jonny <jonny.meibohm at arcor.de>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.10.30 (04) [E]

Beste Lowlannners,

thanks for all your interesting thoughts and informations about the mystic
development of 'to dwell'.
Meanwhile I'm becoming suspicious that in ancient time there may have been
two similar words which melted at any point but the etymologicans didn't
realize.

Surely I shall never be able to use this word correctly because my Low Saxon
mind will refuse its obedience ;-)!

Allerbest!

Jonny Meibohm

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From: Sandy Fleming <sandy at scotstext.org>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.10.30 (04) [E]

> From:  "heatherrendall at tiscali.co.uk" <heatherrendall at tiscali.co.uk>
> Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.10.30 (01) [E]
>
> re ' dwell' Is there a hint of this meaning of 'stray/wander/ be
> somewhere not known' in the Bluebells of Scotland?
>
> << O where, tell me where does your Highland laddie dwell?
>
> O where, tell me where does your Highland laddie dwell?
>
> He dwells in merry Scotland at the sign of the Bluebell
>
> And it's Oh in my heart that I wish him safe and well. >>

I doubt if any etymological data can be extracted about "dwell" from
this, for the simple reason that it's been chosen for the rhyme, not for
semantic accuracy. I would also think that "dwell" would have its modern
(now rather literary) meaning for this writer.

>From an old Scottish nursery song:

There dwalt a puddy in a wal,
   Cuddy alane, cuddy alane,
There dwalt a puddy in a wal,
   Cuddy alane, an I!
There dwalt a puddy in a wal,
   An a moosie in a mill,
Kickmaleerie, cowden doun,
   Cuddy alane an I.

Puddy cam tae the moose's wonne,
   Cuddy alane, cuddy alane,
Puddy cam tae the moose's wonne,
   Cuddy alane, an I!
Puddy cam tae the moose's wonne,
   Mistress Moose, are you within?
Kickmaleerie, cowden doun,
   Cuddy alane an I.

[...]

dwalt: dwelled
wonne: dwelling (also as a verb)
(other Scots words for "to dwell are "stey" and "bide")

puddy: frog
wal: well
moose: mouse

Other lines have been corrupted into nonsense verse over time, I think.

So it would seem to me that the mouse actually "dwells" at her "wonne"
as far as Scottish nursery tradition goes.

Sandy Fleming
http://scotstext.org/

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From: Sandy Fleming <sandy at scotstext.org>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.10.30 (04) [E]

> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Etymology
>
> That sounds like an interesting hypothesis, Heather.
>
> If I understand you correctly, you are talking about semi-nomadic
> herders' lifestyles, following or taking livestock between summer and
> winter pastures. So they don't migrate as such, just change between
> permanent abodes according to the season. This is still the lifestyle
> in large regions of Eurasia and Africa, and there are remnants of it
> in the mountainous regions of Europe as well. I can well imagine that
> this applied to Indo-Europeans.

In Scots, buildings on hillsides and other wild parts, usually just with
basic facilities, for workmen to stay in for part of the year, are
called "shielings" (not dwellings!). I've always assumed this is the
origin of place names like "Galashiels", which would be the shielings at
Gala Water.

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From: Mark Dreyer <mrdreyer at lantic.net>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.10.30 (04) [E]

Dear All

Subject: LL-L "Etymology"

On the subject of 'dwell' in English.

Afrikans doesn't use that word, but there is the cognate with a contrary
prefix 'ver-' "verdwaal" meaning to get lost & "verdwaald" meaning to be
lost. Now that I think of it, there is a phrase that passed into S African
English about a generation or so back, & I heard it even found its way to
Australia, as in 'dwaal, y'know, only *we* say "walkabout."

Yrs,
Mark

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

Hi, Mark! The -dwaal in verdwaal is a cognate of "dwell," isn't it?

Sandy, the following is what the Oxford English Dictionary says:

***
  shielSc. and north.

[Northern ME. shāle, schēle, of obscure origin.
  Prob. connected in some way with the synonymous ON. skále wk. masc.
(whence SCALE n.4). The formal equivalent of this in ONorthumbrian would be
*scéla (= WS. *sceala), which would yield ME. schēle and the later forms.
The 13th c. form shāle may be an adoption of the ON. form with substitution
of initial (ʃ) for (sk), or it may be an alteration of the native word
through association with the ON. form.
  The β forms arose from confusion with SHIELD n.]

*1.* A temporary building, usually of boards; a shepherd's summer hut; a
shanty, shed,SHIELING<http://dictionary.oed.com/cgi/crossref?query_type=word&queryword=shiel&first=1&max_to_show=10&single=1&sort_type=alpha&xrefword=shieling>
.

  The 'shiels' in quot. 1291 are those from which the town of Shields is
named. The place is called 'the shiles by Tinmouth castle' in Bulleyn *Bk.
Simples* (1562) 75b.
*2.* A small house, cottage, hovel.

*+* A piece of pasture ground having a shepherd's hut upon it; a summer
pasturage. *Obs.*

*4.* *Comb.*: *shiel-house* = sense 2; *shiel-town* = sense 3.

shieling, shealing

*Sc.*

[f.SHIEL<http://dictionary.oed.com/cgi/crossref?query_type=word&queryword=shiel&first=1&max_to_show=10&single=1&sort_type=alpha&xrefword=shiel>+
-ING1<http://dictionary.oed.com/cgi/crossref?query_type=word&queryword=shiel&first=1&max_to_show=10&single=1&sort_type=alpha&xrefword=-ing&homonym_no=1>.

  In the vernacular form the word has not been found earlier than the latter
half of the 16th c.; but 13th c. documents show a latinized *scalinga*,
which represents either this word (cf. *schale* early var. of
SHIEL<http://dictionary.oed.com/cgi/crossref?query_type=word&queryword=shiel&first=1&max_to_show=10&single=1&sort_type=alpha&xrefword=shiel>)
or an etymologically equivalent **sk*ā*ling* (f.
SCALE<http://dictionary.oed.com/cgi/crossref?query_type=word&queryword=shiel&first=1&max_to_show=10&single=1&sort_type=alpha&xrefword=scale&ps=n.&homonym_no=4>
*n.*4, ON. *skále*).
  *1225* *Registrum Monast. Passelet* (Maitland Club) 212 Cum libertate
siccandi retia sua et faciendi domos et scalingas piscatoribus suis. *c
1230-68* *Cockersand Chartul.* (Chetham Soc.) I. 259 Versus aquilonem infra
scalingam quæ fuit Candelani et scalingam quam Ricardus..tenuit.]
*1.* A piece of pasture to which cattle may be driven for grazing.
*2.* A hut of rough construction erected on or near such a piece of pasture:
=SHIEL<http://dictionary.oed.com/cgi/crossref?query_type=word&queryword=shiel&first=1&max_to_show=10&single=1&sort_type=alpha&xrefword=shiel&ps=n.>
*n.* 1.

***

Thanks for the nursery rhyme, Sandy! As though it were necessary, just
because it's Halloween and I already saw some enchanting goblins very early
in the morning, I'm offering a Low Saxon version:

'n Lüt pog waan eyns in d'n soud –
   So heyl alleyn, so heyl alleyn –
'n Lüt pog waan eyns in d'n soud –
   So heyl alleyn, un ik!
'n Lüt pog waan eyns in d'n soud –
   Un 'n lüt muus in dey moel –
Nu kyk maal hin! Nu kyk maal daal!
   So heyl alleyn, un ik!

Dey pog keym na dey muus er huus –
   So heyl alleyn, so heyl alleyn –
Dey pog keym na dey muus er huus –
   So heyl alleyn, un ik!
Dey pog keym na dey muus er huus –
   "Moym Muus, sünd Jy wul binn'n?"
Nu kyk maal hin! Nu kyk maal daal!
   So heyl alleyn, un ik!

German-based spelling:

Een lütt Pogg wahn eens in'n Soot –
   So heel alleen, so heel alleen –
Een lütt Pogg wahn eens in'n Soot –
   So heel alleen, un ik!
Een lütt Pogg wahn eens in'n Soot –
   Un 'n lütt Muus in de Mœl –
Nu kiek maal hin! Nu kiek maal daal!
   So heel alleen, un ik!

De Pogg keem na de Muus ehr Huus –
   So heel alleen, so heel alleen –
De Pogg keem na de Muus ehr Huus –
   So heel alleen, un ik!
De Pogg keem na de Muus ehr Huus –
   "Möhm Muus, sünd Ji wull binn'n?"
Nu kiek maal hin! Nu kiek maal daal!
   So heel alleen, un ik!

Enjoy if you care!

Reinhard/Ron
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