LL-L "Etymology" 2007.09.12 (02) [E]

[Lowlands-L List]

L O W L A N D S - L  -  12 September 2007 - Volume 02
Song Contest: lowlands-l.net/contest/ (- 31 Dec. 2007)
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From: jonny <jonny.meibohm at arcor.de>
Subject: LL-L "History" 2007.09.11 (01) [E]

Beste Ron,

you wrote:

The Northern Low Saxon name for Cinderella is Aschenpüüstersch
(['aSnpy:st3S]).

My etymological stab at it is that it means "ash blower" (with the feminine
ending -sch < -sche).
I always thought that 'Aschenputtel' *was* of LS-origin.
The verb LS _puddeln_ (I guess it to be onomatopoetic) we use to denote
birds and chicken taking a bath in the dust or sand, G: '(sich) hudern'.

So 'Aschenputtel' could refer to a person living in the ashes, and in
Grimm's version of the fairytale you can read that her sleeping-place was
besides the hearth.

Wait- I just found the original 'sound' of the GRIMM-brothers themselves:

*ASCHENPUTTEL*, *n.* *der hessische name, vom* putteln *in der asche, wie
hühner, tauben sich im staube* putteln, *wälzen, vgl. nd.* askenbüel

In another version (from Ludwig Bechstein, former Louis Dupontreau) her name
is 'Aschenbroedel'- that sounds to be of Southern German origin, and I don't
have any idea about its meaning.

Allerbest!

Jonny Meibohm

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From: Ronald Veenker <veenker at atmc.net>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.09.11 (08) [E]

Hi, Ron and Elsie,

I love 'klankverspringing'!  Although I certainly not a specialist in
linguistics, I am trying to fetch a term from the classroom when I was
a student of semitic languages about 40 years ago.  My professors used
to speak of it as dental/sybilant metathesis. [Voiceless postalveolar
fricative: root šdl שדל = hištaddēl הִשְתַּדֵּל ("he made an effort")]

Thanks for the ancient memories,

Ron Veenker

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From: Henno Brandsma <hennobrandsma at hetnet.nl>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2007.09.11 (08) [E]

From: Elsie Zinsser < ezinsser at icon.co.za>
Subject: LL-L "History" 2007.09.11 (01) [E]

Hi all,

Ron, Heather, our cinderella is called  "aspoestertjie" and I suspect it
relates more to 'ash polisher'
(poetser) with a bit of 'klankverspringing' causing the shift from 'poetser'
to 'poester'.


No, I agree with our Ron. The name of cinderella is originally Low Saxon, as
written down by the Grimm brothers.
Also in WF we have "pûste" for "blow", so it's a common root, I suppose. It
should be related, I think, to Dutch "puist" (Afr. puis?)
but I don't see the semantic connection yet......

Henno

Elsie Zinsser

The Northern Low Saxon name for Cinderella is Aschenpüüstersch
(['aSnpy:st3S]).

My etymological stab at it is that it means "ash blower" (with the feminine
ending *-sch < -sche*).

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
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