LL-L "Etymology" 2008.03.17 (04) [E]

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L O W L A N D S - L  - 17 March 2008 - Volume 04
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From: Denis dujardin <dujardin at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2008.03.17 (01) [E]

In our west-flemish dialect an "hulle" (pronounciation as the English town
with an "a" after it.) is used for a cover in a large sense ( - cover of
pan, of several kitchen objects -)In dutch "verhullen" means to conceal, to
cover up.

*Denis Dujardin*
*Omgevingen*
*dujardin at pandora.be*
*www.denisdujardin.be*
*Flanders-Belgium*

----------

From: Jorge Potter <jorgepot at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2008.03.16 (01) [E]

Dear Luc Hellinckx and rest of Lowlanders,

First of all, thank you for analyzing your surname so completely.

Then thank you for providing the references in your e-mail from Sunday 16th:

Giving this topic a somewhat more Lowlandish twist, here's a list of German
> words, having non-PIE-"cognates":
>
> http://home.arcor.de/urdeutsche/index11.htm
>
> And :-D , to your utter delight, you will see that the same author,
> Marcelo Jolkesky, even mentions a Hamburger-culture, 14000 years before Big
> Mac was invented:
>
> http://home.arcor.de/urdeutsche/index8.htm
>

Allow me to quote from the first:

*Ache, sf. „Wasserlauf**"** (8. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* aχe < *ahd.* aha < *as.* aha
< *urgerm.* *aχwo „Fluss" (> *got.* awva „Fluss", *anord.* evja „Sumpf") < *
urural.* *jak „Fluss, See, Eis" (> *ursam.* *jaχa, *urugr.* *jok,
*urfinn.* *joki
„Fluss"; *ursam.* *jaχak, *urugr.* *jaŋk, *urfinn.* *jak „See"; *ursam.* *sek,
*urugr.* *jek, *urfinn.* *juk „Eis") → *urital.* *akwa „Wasser"; auch *
urindoeur.* *lak „See".

*Amme, sf. (11. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* ame < *ahd.* ama < *urgerm.* *ama „Mutter"(>
*got.* awo, *anord.* ama „Großmutter") < *urindoeur.* *ama „Mutter,
Großmutter" < *urural.* *oma (> *ursam.* *ama, *urugr.* *oma, *urfinn.* *ema
„Mutter"; *ursam.* *imi, *urfinn.* *mumo „Großmutter").

*Anger, sm. „Wiese**"** (8. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* aŋger < *ahd.* aŋgar <
*urgerm.* *aŋger
„Feld" (> *anord.* aŋgr) < *urindoeur.* *war < *urural.* *ker „Belag, Boden,
Feld, Steppe, Blatt" (> *urugr.* *ker, *urfinn.* *keri „Belag"; *ursam.* *ir,
*urugr.* *kerkeð, *urfinn.* *koru „Boden"; *ursam.* *karað, *urugr.* *karta,
*urfinn.* *karta „Feld"; *ursam.* *χora, *urugr.* *uri, *urfinn.* *aro
„Steppe"; *ursam.* *χora, *urugr.* *ker, *urfinn.* *kor „Blatt"; *urugr.* *ukar
„Tal) → *urbalt.* *skura, *urslaw.* *korda, „Belag"; *urgerm.* *gir, *
urtoch.* *terker, *urgriech.* *ge „Boden"; *uranat.* *gimari „Steppe"; *
uranat.* *χari „Tal"; *uriran.* *bar, *urarm.* *gawar, *urgriech.* *koros
„Ort".

*Arsch, sm. (11. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* ars < *ahd.* ars < *as.* ars < *urgerm.* *arsa
(> *anord.* ars) < *urfinn.* *perse < *urural.* *wars „Arsch, Schwanz, Darm,
Loch" (> *urugr.* *βar „Arsch"; *urugr.* *iras, *urfinn.* *para „Schwanz"; *
ursam.* *βere, *urugr.* *χur „Darm"; *ursam.* *si, *urugr.* *as, *urfinn.* *os
„Loch") → *ne.* arse; *nschw.* arsel; *nisl.* rass; *urarm.* *or, *urgriech.
* *oros „Arsch"; *uriran.* *er, *urgriech.* *ura „Schwanz".

*Ätti, sm. „Vater**"** (16. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* ate < *ahd.* ato < *urgerm.* *ata
(> *got.* ata, *anord.* ati) < *urindoeur.* *wata „Vater, Herr" <
*urural.* *ata
„Vater, Mann, Herr, Held" (> *ursam.* *ata, *urugr.* *ati, *urfinn.* *ata
„Vater"; *ursam.* *koðumu, *urugr.* *atama, *urfinn.* *atem „Mann";
*ursam.* *sata,
*urfinn.* *saŋtə „Herr"; *ursam.* *mater, *urugr.* *ater „Held"; *ursam.* *iða
„Onkel") → *nhd.* Adel, edel; *urtoch.* *atel „Mann"; *urkelt.* *ajte
„Pflegevater"; *urbalt.* *ded „Onkel".

*Aue, sf. „Flußlandschaft, Flußinsel**" (10. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* owe < *ahd.* owa
< *urgerm.* *awa „Fluss" (> *got.* awva, *anord.* o) < *urugr.* *pa „Fluss"<
*urural.* *po „Fluss, Eis, schwimmen" (> *ursam.* *pu „Fluss"; *ursam.* *poj,
*urugr.* *poj, *urfinn.* *ja „Eis"; *ursam.* *palam, *urugr.* *pawl, *
urfinn.* *pilas „schwimmen"; auch *ursam.* *pə „Wasser, „fließen") → *nhd.* Au;
*nschw.* ö; auch *urindoeur.* *apə „Fluss" (> *urbalt.* *ap; *uriran.* *ab;
*urtoch.* *ap; *uranat.* *χapa; *urkelt.* *awoŋ).

*Baum, sm. (8. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* bowm < *ahd.* bowm < *as.* bom <
*urgerm.* *bawma
(>. *got.* bagms, *anord.* baðmr) < *urural.* *paw „Baum, Holz, Grass" (> *
ursam.* *paw, *urugr.* *pa, *urfinn.* *puw „Baum"; *urugr.* *pugeŋ, *urfinn.
* *pane „Holz"; *ursam.* *um, *urugr.* *pum „Grass") → *nhd.* bäumen;
*ne.* beam;
*urslaw.* *pjewa; *urgriech.* *poa.

*Berg, sm. (8. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* berk < *ahd.* berg < *urgerm.* *birgaŋ (> *
got.* bjargahej „Gebirge", *anord.* berg „Felsen") < *urural.* *porki „Berg,
Turm, Boden, Staub, hoch" (> *ursam.* *pakir, *urfinn.* *βara „Berg"; *
urugr.* *βar, *urfinn.* *kopariko „Turm"; *urugr.* *porku, *urfinn.* *pera
„Boden"; *ursam.* *palkas, *urugr.* *porke, *urfinn.* *purka „Staub"; *
ursam.* *pirki, *urfinn.* *korki „hoch") → *nhd.* Burg, Gebirge; *ne.* barrow;
*nschw.* berg; *nisl.* berg; *urindoeur.* *werke „Boden, hoch";
*urgerm.* *birgaŋ,
*uriran.* *bers „Berg"; *urkelt.* *perkraχ „Feld"; *urital.* *worja „Staub";
*urarm.* *partak, *uralb.* *perkraχ „decken".

*bergen, v. (8. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* bergeŋ < *ahd.* bergaŋ < *urgerm.* *berge (>
*got.* bajrgaŋ, *anord.* bjarga) < *urural.* *porkə „verstecken, Staub,
Berg, Boden, Wurzel" (> *urugr.* *bor, *urfinn.* *pelk „verstecken"; *ursam.
* *palkas, *urugr.* *porke, *urfinn.* *purka „Staub"; *ursam.* *pakir, *
urfinn.* *βara „Berg"; *urugr.* *porku, *urfinn.* *pera „Boden";
*urugr.* *βurkoɲa,
*urfinn.* *porkaŋ „Wurzel") → *nhd.* Bürge, Herberge, verbergen, verbürgen,
beherbergen; *nschw.* bärga; *nisl.* bjarga; *urindoeur.* *werke „Boden,
hoch"; *urgerm.* *birgaŋ, *uriran.* *bers „Berg"; *urital.* *worja „Staub";
*urarm.* *partak, *uralb.* *perkraχ „decken".

*binden, v. (8. Jh.)*, < *mhd.* biŋdeŋ < *ahd.* biŋtaŋ < *as.* biŋdaŋ < *
urgerm.* *beŋda (> *got.* biŋdaŋ, *anord.* biŋda) < *urindoeur.* *pat
„Binde, binden, stechen, verstecken, verbreiten, schlagen" < *urural.* *pet
„Binde, binden, stechen, verstecken, halten, nehmen, Stock" (> *urugr.* *βot,
*urfinn.* *piŋt „Binde"; *urugr.* *pit, *urfinn.* *peða „binden";
*urugr.* *peð,
*urfinn.* *paŋt „stechen"; *ursam.* *poð, *urugr.* *pota, *urfinn.* *peŋta
„verstecken"; *urugr.* *wete, *urfinn.* *pita „halten"; *ursam.* *potja, *
urugr.* *wete, *urfinn.* *βot „nehmen"; *urugr.* *βot, *urfinn.* *poðo
„Stock") → *nhd.* Band, Bendel, Bund, Bündel, Verband, Bote, Bütte, Büttel,
Gebiet, Beitel, Beutel, anbandeln, bitten, beten, bieten, beißen, bündeln,
bitter; *ne.* bind, bid, bite, beat, butt, bootle, pot, put, bandage; *
nschw.* binda, bedja, bita, bytta, butelj, band, bandage; *nisl.* binda,
bidja, bíta, band, bandasje.

It is incredibly difficult to accept that *Opa, Oma, Arsch, Baum, Berg,
binden* etc.are not Indoeuropean, but here Marcelo Jolkesky seems to have
proved it. This is another chunk in the structure for the case that all
languages in the world, except for the clicking language of the Kalahari
Desert, come from a common source. And that would be the language of
the first Homo sapiens to come out of Africa.

Then from the second link we have five maps of ethnic *Kulturen* from 12,000
BC and two maps, presumably of languages to 1000 BC. But it would be hard to
pinpoint what stage of whatever language.

Thanks again,

Jorge Potter
----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

I'm not quite sure all this was meant to be serious.

What's up with all those engs (ŋ), anyhow? Is it a decoding problem?

Where did he get the Indo-European data? For instance, where I come from
Indo-European for 'bind' is **bhindh-* (cf. Sanskrit भन्ध- *bhandh-* and
भिन्ध- *bhindh*).

None of this is to say that I'm not open to proposals of IE-Uralic contacts
and even family relations.

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
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