LL-L "Language varieties" 2008.10.24 (02) [D/E]

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L O W L A N D S - L - 24 October 2008 - Volume 02
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From: David B. Frank <davidbfrank at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language learning" [E]

Hello Lowlands List,

The Bible has been translated into Gronings.  The completion of this project
was announced Thursday, October 23, 2008.
http://www.gic.nl/nieuws/presentatie-vertaalde-biebel-in-martinikerk

Kind regards,
David B. Frank

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From: Diederik Masure <didimasure at hotmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2008.10.23 (05) [D]

Hey David!
partially this may be true, a part of people from different origins (may it
be people from Arab descent as well as Easterners or Southerners) use this
to put themselves in a victim role, but partially this might also be true.

I am a Belgian student living in the Randstad (Amsterdam), and I never had a
problem finding a (student)job here - people are very open to people with
Belgian accents, think it's cute and all; but on the other hand you feel
that they take you slightly less serious anyway when you say something. I
heard the same from people who come from Limburg or Brabant in the south -
they are taken less serious on their jobs.

So you will be subject to more laughter on the workfloor. But I guess that's
the same for British people working in the States, or the other way round.
If you want to beat the dog you'll always find a stick, as we say in Dutch.
Of course you feel personally attacked when people make fun of your
language/accent, but if people want to make fun of you they'll always find
something, regardless.

Diederik

From: David B. Frank <davidbfrank at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Language learning" 2008.10.23 (03) [E/LS]


Een aardig stel van uit Delfzijl (Delfziel) bezocht ons een kort tijd
geleden.  De vrouw vertelde me dat het moeilijk voor haar zou kunnen zijn om
een baan in de randstad te vinden vanwege haar Groningse accent.  Niet dat
zij het Gronings sprak, maar slechts  dat zij een accent had ?????  Nou, dat
was voor mij een verrassing en tegenover mijn errvaringen hier in de V.S.
Alhoewel ik een redelijk sterke "hillbilly" accent heb, gebruik ik goede
grammatica (in het Engels) en ik heb maar weinige problemen ooit ervan
gehad, inderdaad, soms is mijn accent een voordeel.  Voel je je dat je
mogelijkheden daar in Nederland beperkt zijn dankzij je accent?  Of
misschien is het gewoon een smoesje van haar, dwz, 'ik ben een Noordenlinger
en ik kan geen baan in het westen vinden . . snik . . .snik' ?



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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Language variety

Hey, Diederik, David and all!

David, what you say about you having "few" problems in the States with a
"hillbilly" accent (but good grammar) is interesting. I know several people
who are in that sort of position and tell me similar things. However, there
seems to be some sort of glass ceiling for them. They tend to be
disadvantaged in certain fields and regarding higher-level positions,
especially where verbal communication with the public is concerned. It is
perhaps a little better in academia where people are supposed to be more
open-minded ("supposed to be" being the operative phrase here). I work with
one person with a Cajun accent who worked himself up to a very high
position, possibly because of his celebrated publications and his strategic
skills. Another person, with a very heavy Kentucky accent and apparently no
desire to tone it down finds herself hitting the glass ceiling everywhere
(and being a woman probably doesn't help). It seems she is not being taken
seriously, and her teaching evaluations may very well be skewed by students'
prejudice. She now works her natural humor and quirkiness and finds herself
more accepted because she now has a shtick, if you know what I mean.

Diederik, you said, "But I guess that's the same for British people working
in the States, or the other way round."

The other way around may or may not be accurate. I found that Americans were
taken quite seriously in Australia (though there may be the occasional
"Yank" cracks). British, Australian and New Zealand accents are generally
perceived as pleasant in the US. The average American tends to think of them
as sounding sophisticated and educated, sometimes intimidating, no matter
how low-class specific dialects may be considered in their home countries.
In circles with higher education levels many people are able to
differentiate between "good" and "bad" British accents and are aware that
most British people consider Australian English vulgar sounding (because it
shares many features with low-class dialects of Southern England), and they
may adopt that attitude in order to be "with it." By and large, though,
having a "British accent" can be quite advantageous in the US. This may be
one of the reasons why I stayed on that side of the divide myself. Even when
just starting to talk with me, people tend to take me seriously, find me
interesting and assume that I'm highly educated. Besides that, some people
find it very attractive and some go as far as flirting with me ... ;-)

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

•

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