LL-L "Resources" 2009.04.15 (06) [E/French]

[Lowlands-L List]

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L O W L A N D S - L - 15 April 2009 - Volume 06
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From: Roger Thijs, Euro-Support, Inc. <roger.thijs at euro-support.be>
Subject: LL-L "Resources" 2009.04.15 (05) [E]

 > From: Mustafa Umut Sarac <mustafaumutsarac at ymail.com>
> Subject: Tintin + Brussels Marols
> I learned that Brussels people talk about 3 different types of Marols.
 > I want to learn the which one that used to create the Syldavian at
Tintin.

I'm not a specialist of Tintin, but I read on url:
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syldavie
*La langue syldave, proche du néerlandais, est inspirée du brusseleer[1],
mais emprunte également quelques traits particuliers du wallon. Les lecteurs
néerlandophones peuvent donc suivre le Syldave assez facilement.*
*- Eih bennek, eih blavek (devise syldave) : proche du néerlandais Hier ben
ik, hier blijf ik (Ici je suis, ici je reste) ;
- Czesztot on klebcz (lorsqu'un paysan voit Milou tomber du ciel) : un
savoureux mélange wallon-argot français C'èsteût on clebs (C'est un chien).*

This means it is a mixture of everything (Brussels Brabantish, Brussels
French, Walloon, French Slang), but apparently most is Brabantish from
Brussels, rewritten with an exotic orthograhy (close to the pronounciation
in the local variety).

Apparently 4 tintin books touch Syldavie:
*La Syldavie dans les albums de Tintin
Elle est le théâtre, principal ou partiel, des événements survenant dans
quatre albums des aventures de Tintin et Milou :
- Le Sceptre d'Ottokar (1939),
- Objectif Lune (1953),
- On a marché sur la Lune (1954),
- L'Affaire Tournesol (1956 - suggéré en fin d'album).*

Hope this helps,
Regards,
Roger

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From: Hellinckx Luc <luc.hellinckx at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Resources"

Beste Mustafa,
You wrote:

I am an fan of comics hero Tintin and I learned that its creator Herge also
created a artificial language called Syldavian. It is Brussels Marols and
few Slavic language mixture.
I learned that Brussels people talk about 3 different types of Marols.
I want to learn the which one that used to create the Syldavian at Tintin.
And I need to learn the language and I need correct book.


You probably got to learn there's 3 versions of "Marols" because of the
Lowlands-link here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marols

that points to a message that Roger Thijs once sent to Georg Deutsch:

http://www.zompist.com/syldavian.html

I'm afraid it'll be pretty hard to get hold of the appropriate language
materials as it's a vernacular that is both dying out fast à nd it has low
prestige. On the other hand, there seems to be a renewed interest, because
at some places in Brussels, one can start learning Brussels dialect again.
Whether they have resources on paper or on the internet, I doubt it (*).

The first version of "Marols" is the original one, and is the one that must
have inspired Hergé; more information here:

http://www.zompist.com/syldavian.html

This is Brussels speech from the so called "Huuëgstroet", which is plain
Brabantish, but interspersed with loads of French words and expressions
(plus some occasional Spanish, going back to the Spanish occupation). It may
sound horrible to some, but to me it's not any more weird than modern
(northern) Dutch which is nowadays also frequently sprinkled with English
idiom. The grammatical base of this "Marols" is definitely Dutch.

To my knowledge, Slavic influence has no historical grounds in "Marols"
(Brussels is not Vienna, even though there are some similarities ;=)), so I
tend to think this is entirely the result of Hergé's artistic freedom. Bear
in mind that Hergé was primarily a French speaking "Brusseleir", so in his
ears, the raw native Dutch sounds of the Brussels dialect may have led him
to interpret "Dutch Marols" as some kind of Balkan lingo. The same can be
said about Syldavian itself: on the one hand I understand it's spoken in a
fictitious country that has a passage to the sea, on the other it's located
north of the Danube...which is kind of a contradiction, because Romania is
not really Balkan and the Syldavian flag resembles the Albanian somewhat.

For me, the perfect soundtrack of Hergé's "King Ottokar's Sceptre" should be
provided by "3 Mustaphas 3", a great band that was very much into
"Balkanica" during the 80's:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3_mustaphas_3

Anyway, regarding language materials, I'm quite sure that Roger Thijs (also
a member here) may be able to help you more.

I wish you success!

Kind greetings,

Luc Hellinckx

(*): Fine lad, who thinks that Brussels dialect is not yet moribund is Geert
Van Istendael (author). Off the record, Geert admits he would still like to
become organ player in a Northern German protestant church *s*.

http://www.standaard.be/Artikel/Detail.aspx?artikelId=gbu7db8c

•

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